훌륭한 반려견 훈련의 비결 || 2회 세계 챔피언 Ivan Balabanov가 성공의 비결을 공유합니다!

3:56

at this i know i like to do it so then i went to belgium and that was um yeah like i'd say 88 or something like that it's 88.89 um i got my first malinois i wanted a malinois i knew that i wanted malinois but all i knew about them was at the time just a picture from a magazine and dog trainers talking about them so when i first saw them you know i was um i mean i was so convinced that i'm gonna have one that it really didn't matter what i would see and the first one that i saw it was very funny because he he had like this crazy overbite i mean he really looked like a parrot you know but it was a cool dog and i was like that's that's what i want so from there um i started you know naturally from the that kind of military training i did i moved into the bell generating programs and yeah i was fortunate enough to to meet some of the legends i mean as far as dogs and trainers at the time um so it really you know like all my risk that i took and all this care that i had to go through it really really paid off like almost right away i was like yeah no that that's what you want to do and so yeah as far as malin was that was a very very special time because it wasn't just bulgaria i mean most of the world didn't know much about them um besides the ring circles the french ring and the belgian ring and the dutch sports kmpv and so on but other than that they were they were not that popular if if at all um so i i pretty much grew up in the dog training world along with the malinois the popularity um so i got my first one in belgium and uh like i made some connections i made some friends so it was the the kennel name is the diopua so i don't know it's like people that are really really into the breed they that would say a lot to them people that are studying or not familiar with the breed that probably will be a name that they have heard that doesn't mean much to them but um that specific channel was uh probably single-handedly like what made the breed boom in the 90s and the late 80s um so yeah i i got to meet the breeder his name's uh luke vance the brush that's a kind of lives in a french part of the country and i told him that i want to do sports and want to compete in a high level and he's he got excited it was for me like when i moved to belgium i didn't even speak english i didn't so it was pretty hard in the beginning but on top of that he only speaks french so we were like just sign language and and having always somebody to help us translate but um there was a really funny story that when i decided to get my first puppy and i go to him and he knows that i'm going to get a puppy and we see them it's kind of typical for at least at the time

7:46

in belgium you go when you talk dogs but you sit down have some beers drink and talk so it was good time and then there is this little nice dark male puppy that's maybe nine weeks old just walking around the room and i can't get my eyes off of it i mean it's like the most gorgeous puppy i've seen i'm like i want this one and the guy is like no that's just not that's just a another topic for work and now i really thought that he's just trying to think that i'm not gonna be good enough for that puppy or something you know but anyway we wait so he's like okay i'm gonna bring you the dog that i have in mind and he brings me this one female and she's already like probably four four and a half months old i mean it's like not that it's still a puppy but it's a older puppy down the typical eight week old one and she has this big white chest and white feet and it just completely something that i didn't think a female and an older and all this white on her and i'm like no i don't want this talk like we were like and so we had a really really big like debates conversations like i mean almost at the point that i see he's getting upset that me and i'm getting upset at him and finally like my friends trying to translate it put a piece in that whole discussion you know because i'm so convinced that i want this one and he's like if you're gonna do sport that's the dog you should take and so he was so cool that eventually what happened he told me okay you take both take the puppy that you like take the female and in two weeks you're gonna bring one back whatever whichever one you do so of course i mean within three days i knew which one so i kept the female and that was kind of how i started um she she ended up being my um uh foundation female for my kennel dude with shamalino and we had the first the first puppies was uh 1989 or 90. um so then from there i i was really this was the time when monday rings started to basically monitoring got introduced and there was the french ring sport people the belgian ring sport people some germans but not that many of course the dutch crowd and they will meet and they will make demonstrations and they will get in all these fights of which program is better and which exercise from this one should go there and that was a very interesting time in the history of the sports um eventually i decided i'm gonna move to the states for no apparent reason like i didn't know nobody i didn't know where i'm gonna go but somehow belgium just started to be very small for me like you know in my head like really no reason for it and so i started kind of do some research and i hear that there is a possibility that you can

11:25

get a job as a dog trainer like actually you know getting paid to train dogs which at that time in europe was something people would laugh at even when i was leaving bulgaria my mom would be like you hopefully you get a job soon because these dogs that's not gonna be you know you're not gonna be good like that um and so anyway went to the move to the states it was uh it was pretty much san diego los angeles or san francisco for no reason like really for no reason and eventually ended up in san francisco because it just somehow sounded better to me at the moment um so i started to look for jobs and and i was not really thinking i'm going to get a job as a doctor you know um i'm like i was pretty good electrician at the time and so i'm walking around trying to find some job and i see trainers with guide dogs walking around on a street so i start following them and then i see them getting loading the dogs in a van and i just ran to my car and i just really followed them to to the guido school in san rafael in california and yeah i i'm like okay i need to i i want to get a job here whatever job it is but i'm going to work my way and i'm going to train dogs here it was you know um so they they kind of laughed at me but appreciated their enthusiasm i guess they're like well we don't have jobs right now and there is a process and you know we have applications and just kind of being very nice saying that it's not gonna work um but they were curious i mean like the accent that i have now it was pretty much the same so it was interesting for them that it's okay it's a foreigner and and it's a dog person so i was like well what kind of dog training you do and what is the methods do you know this book or this just all this old school american dog training booths that i've never heard of of course because i didn't grow up here like no i don't know but i'm sure i can do better i just always had a very big confidence and big mouth um so to to make it a little short day i went i went back home i mean it was kind of like i i didn't give up but they said yeah we will call you at some point but pretty much trying to tell me that it's just not gonna work out but next thing you know like three days later the training director of the school calls me he's like well do you want to come we want to test you like of course i wanted to make me like what time and so i went and then they did and yeah i ended up taking getting the job and went through their whole program being an apprentice and instructor and so on um and that was really good for me in one hand because i really i didn't know anybody i didn't have any you know like credit card history or

15:02

anything like this you know and that was a very very well paid job and very secure job so it was just beautiful how things were working out always you know it's one of those things that as bob marley says where there is a will there is a way and so but it was very demanding job i learned so much there i also told them so much and there were so many stories from from the school at the time like it was very typical you know traditional training i mean you cannot the the best you can do is maybe praise the dog a little bit but forget about playing or giving them a treat or something you know it was a very like a you know really traditional style old school but that was really really really really good experience um like when i teach in my school right now i have so many stories and so many examples of of how to train dogs and and yeah like it always always comes to mind eventually though i had to you know i got on my feet and unfortunately i couldn't compete at the time because of the schedule of the school the school always had a very rigid just like just like any school you know this is when the students will come this is when they're gonna go home now you have vacation and if it happens that there is some competition great i was always out of luck like all the big competitions for five years i could not go to it was really frustrating on on that end of things so then i was okay i will move on to something else so then i went back to san francisco and i got a job at the spca the san francisco spca and that was a that was a also very interesting job because it was the first nokia shelter in the world at the time and that's early 90s and in early 90s there was a lot of people fighting underground like a lot in the area so they will do all sorts of riots and bring just 20 50 60 dogs and yeah it was a very interesting experience to to work there but it also allowed me to have free time and do the things that i wanted to do with my own dogs so then i started to do more and more club training and competitions and people started to see that there is something different that i do and of course the interest kept growing to the point that i literally was forced to stop my job because i just had so many clients and so many places that i can make money that that that was impossible i am coming from you know from eastern europe um i i wouldn't even say middle class family we were pretty poor where i come from um so in my head it was always i have to work i have to make money you cannot say no to any client then the moment in time came to where it was you know i'm like no i i cannot not say no because i'm just gonna train myself like i will start to hate

18:54

what i do so then i stopped the to work for anybody and then i started my own thing that was like i think 98 or 1999 um yeah and and that was also i mean talking back to with my parents and my friends in europe and it's like oh no i just i'm training dogs and they're like you gotta start to think about your future you're gonna get old and you're not gonna whatever you might just slip me along and so from there a lot of competitions a lot of different you know um i still kept doing ring sport i still do i like it um we trained uh i mean the very first dog that went to the monde ring world championship was one of my breeding and trained from a puppy all the way by me so that was a pretty cool accomplishment i did with the female that i had i did uh i did some competitions but it was not easy because um again with the time that i have it was difficult to to find time to train so and what was interesting i was always making my own training i always had my own ideas i always i always would look somebody training and i'm like okay i can do this better and i can better and i can do this better and and somehow it was happening yeah i mean it wasn't just you know talking until eventually i started to see that well i would go to competitions in like in the late 90s i remember like in some san francisco that the whole bay area there like all the clubs they would not really want me to go to compete because they have their club trial they wanted their members do well and it just doesn't make sense for me to go and just take over you know so but we are good friends and i help them all the time but what we agreed on is that i always will enter the last dog in the trial so the judges don't have any criteria right from the beginning so um and then eventually i won i won my first national championship and what is cool about my accomplishments they're they're truly my accomplishments like i i dread my dogs i train my dogs the way i train not taking anything from anywhere and yeah so i won one competition then i won another one and then i don't know i probably have won 15 or 16 national championships i won two world championships all with those that i breed all with those that i train um so then yeah from from california then i was like i wanted to really have more space we ended up training a lot of like it was a very beautiful area right by the golden gate bridge for anybody that lives around there uh presidio park presidio and i was working with all the police there so they would give me green light and we would train in this really just the most beautiful place in the world that the temperature is always 70 degrees no matter what

22:49

month it is and then you have the ocean and you have the golden gate bridge and it's just like the really the paradise of places but it wasn't mine so i couldn't really i wanted to have something on my own and and that's kind of how i ended up in florida um so from there yeah very very much into breeding genetics training science all of it awesome you have a lot to be proud of um i want to bring this uh wrap this into the genetics because it sounds like you are you have been you're genetically programmed to be very confident and go for it you know when with the the first malinois breeder you're telling the breeder hey i want this dog he's telling you you know take that dog and you're like no i want this or uh you know going to the different countries not knowing the language there's uh you have to be very confident to put yourself in that position how does it work with um the dogs that you select for your the sports and just how you go about breeding in general yeah so um yeah my story with genetics it's a it's an interesting one um like when i when i really really got into it again coming coming with a background from military type of training in the 80s that's a pretty hardcore you know just young and crunk training and then um kind of the whole positive training came in don't shoot the dog came out karen pryor just blew everybody's minds away that positive reinforcement can do everything um so of course everybody jumped on the bandwagon i mean who wouldn't like if you if you really think that there is a better way why would you not regardless of what it is right so i spent um i spent a good three four years in it in fact the i wrote a book in the 90s late 90s so it's called advanced shoots contain a lot of the a lot of my views were still very much that the core was uh to use negative punishment and a lot of positive reinforcement and you know avoid the versa type of training but of course when you when you actually just um you don't want to just sound like oh this works better than something else but you actually have to be able to prove that it does and that proof always felt short and i was i'm extremely good trainer like i you know i i don't have problems talking like this because i really am but if i cannot if i can use positive reinforcement and shaping and all this the whole ideology as it was booming at the time and i was not able to make the results that i want and i was seeing my dogs getting frustrated if anything even though you know we were avoiding compulsion and and things like that but

26:43

um there was just a limitation and then there was another thing with that started to be a very problematic for me and again this i teach a lot on my modules at the school now for for the young people that learn um like like the whole skinnerian behaviorism and how basically how that ideology came up to today was you know there was a guy named watson and you know some people know some people don't but there was like a way back in time he had a very famous quote that he um you know the at the time they believe that you can do anything you can accomplish absolutely anything through reinforcement and punishment i just a matter of studying with a so-called clean slate which they also believed so he had a very famous saying that it's still used today that um if you give me 10 young children i will make them whatever i want i'll make them a doctor or a thief you know just through that and of course now we know that that's not it just cannot happen that way and the reason it cannot happen is because of genetics because all of us actually come programmed with certain things you know like when we talk about primary reinforcers it's uh um we always think of certain things but one of the really cool things to to look at when you think of primary reinforcers is that it's uh something that it's innate something that you don't need to learn you're coming in at you're coming on earth programmed ready to do it you know like like um yeah there's so many examples of this but you know just just like how um a shark doesn't need to learn that it's a shark they they know they're shark um you know you when it's time for you to reproduce you know that it's time to reproduce you you don't need to learn you get better but you come programmed with certain things and uh as dog trainers that's uh somehow it's still uh cloudy area and especially young trainers and meaning not young trainers but uh trainers that are starting in the industry um of course some some very famous trainers as well unfortunately but every a lot of them think that um you can just just like watson said that you can change behavior or guided through reinforcement and punishment and it's just not possible it's just not possible um certain behaviors that are in your genetic makeup you cannot you cannot change um you know like in in the early 80s whatever the whole gay community of being in san francisco i heard all about it and and and i the interest in genetics and the whole reinforcement behaviorism um you know they were trying to do all sorts of things like they will show them a man and they will give them a shock

30:39

and then reward them when they see a magazine with a woman and it don't work of course it cannot work if this is against what your genes are telling you who you are and what you need to do so um it becomes a very very big problem with dog training because often dog trainers want to show off how good they are so if something is not working they just start to press more and demand more i never really recognize and never really even looking for what is possible and what is not possible um of course you can change you can suppress things but the moment you allow it some freedom it go it will go to a home base and whatever the home base is you you better know what it is and the best thing that you can do as a doctriner is to learn how to guide it instead of try to flip it around and change it to something else so when you when um you know i i just realized more and more the the power of genetics um there was you know like in in the 60s already the whole schenerian behaviorism started to break down like big time there were so many cool cool studies that came up and to show basically that that's not true that there is you know you cannot change everything through reinforcement and punishment and also the instincts of the dogs i mean it used to be that they didn't even believe that there is instinct instincts then of course there is the ethology and the behaviorism but eventually what really became very powerful was the evolutionary psychology which kind of really starts to explain why we do those things like for example you know if you start walking on the grass and all of a sudden you jump away and you probably just saw a stick or a hose but that evolution of your success of survival has programmed that very deeply knew that this will be a snake and you will have to jump out and um when you yeah genetics are so so interesting i can really talk for for days and days about it um there is something you know even even people think courage or bravery everything is really genetic like you you actually have a genetic predisposition to be this kind of person or a dog that when situation comes it's not that you are not afraid it's not that you're whatever but you're ready to put it all in and okay today i'm gonna die that's fine but i'm in and that's that's another genetic thing and so it's the other one oh i'm gonna just stay away i am as a puppy a little bit shy a little bit i'm sure and those puppies suffer a lot and those dogs also suffer a lot and mostly from dog trainers that don't understand genetics because they are convinced that there is some magic that they will do and that dog all of a sudden is going to be the confident dog like the other one

34:34

and it just sends a sad for the dog that um this is not recognized then and providing the the environment that that dog's gonna strive and flourish with and instead we are trying to fix something that's not fixable and just tormenting the dogs like that um and that happens all the time if it's a such a bad idea um so genetics really like um there was um there is a very cool book and again like i mean we i don't know i think at least i have three more jobs in my school that i talk about this but there is a book that i highly recommend anybody that's interested in genetics um i mean there's few books but let's just say one uh it's a robot plumbing and the book name is uh blueprint and there is always the debate about nurture versus nature right environment versus genetics which one will which one is more important and which one can influence the other and of course they interact with each other so the way genetics work is uh let's say um let's let's say you go you you're not really a gardener but you take a shovel and you start doing some things and pretty soon you get callouses and those calluses there you know they're genetically ready to come out at the right time but if you avoid certain things then they don't need to come out right but that doesn't mean that you're really uh changing genetics there's just no need for them right now but they're there at any moment so um plumbing did a really really cool studies um almost kind of what i think stumbled upon some accident of in the world war war in in england there was a you know a lot of adoptions mothers were just dropping their babysit orphanages because it's a war and twins identical twins and the difference between identical twins and the normal twins is that they are actually like when you think of cloned animal or a person the uh identical twins are basically clone you know they're that's why they're called identical is that the x splits into and so that means that they are really super interesting material for observation and study for for this kind of study um the the one kid gets adopted by some middle class family the other one goes to a super rich well-off family nobody knows where the other one no no connection nothing and it just so happens that one day they meet at the university they just walk at each other in a hallway and they know it's just like you don't need to say nothing it's like you know and then they start talking to each other and of course the events of the day like the same similar music the same food the same interest in science even their wives have the same features like like it's just amazing what starts to come out and besides that sensation of all this

38:31

is so cool then they start to really evaluate it's like okay well how come he grew up in a completely different environment than him but ultimately they're right here and depending on the day when you measure one is a little bit more excitable or more irritated but then on another day you know but they're they're basically identical and so next thing you know there was they are showing them on tv and there is a third one and that's very uncommon to have three identical twins super uncommon but he sees them on tv and he knows like there is nothing to you know there's absolutely nothing to say he just packs and goes and drives to the university and um there is a movie actually there is a movie i i can't remember what was the movie called but anybody that's interested in genetics and stuff that's twins studies are super cool and they they prove they just flip everything around and no matter how you like it or you don't like it you have to accept it because uh uh what what plumbing says it's very cool uh especially with how dog trainers believe that okay i'm gonna get the little puppy and i'm gonna make him whatever i want it does not work that way no matter what you try there is a genetic makeup that has limitations and he has direction just like a a kid that the mom says no you're gonna play piano and and that's you're gonna be really good at it or you're gonna play tennis or whatever the idea is you know um the interest is the interesting thing about genetics is even in those cases when the mom wants to teach the kid to play something or be good at something and eventually get to school and then eventually get the money and so on it's that you know if it's a boy it's gonna end up attracting females and it's gonna be able to reproduce and reproduction and you know it's it's a very important things for the genes so even though you don't know but that's ultimately evolutionary psychology that's telling this not to go too far off on this one what plumbing says is very cool that he says parents are in uh parents how how was it parents are important but they don't matter it's a very tricky thing and it's very very hard to accept and what it means is it's not that you can live without your parents of course having parents and having nice family that's taking care of you and doing things it's great but they don't matter in terms of the your genetic predisposition like like kids that's gonna you know somebody's gonna start to go through the school system and they parents gonna help them with the homework and get all ace a space and move on to the high school and eventually work its way college still okay and then eventually

42:05

they're paying a ton of money and the kid is in the university and now they either have to somehow continue to help or there will be a very hard check it's like no you really are cannot be just because you want um and and it's the same with dogs it's the same with puppies there's so many cool studies and especially after this one that i was telling you um plumbing they there i think it's in millions like since the 96 or something they've done this up till right now just extensive studies on on twins and you you know like i don't know if you have siblings but anybody that does or anybody that has kids knows very well that they can grow up they do grow up in the same environment they are taking care in the same way and they still have their own thoughts and their own interests unless there is that genetic makeup that you know the identical twins kind of thing um so these the genetics are you know super neglected and it goes all the way back to the behaviorism that we are taught that you know you can be anything you want to be now that doesn't mean that you don't try you know like if you if you want to be a world champion you have to say that you're going to be a world champion i guess because if you just are going and now i'm just training to test myself and to see where i am no nobody ever succeeds that way you know you're just putting yourself right there and that's where you are but it's also not good to fool yourself there is a lot of you know like uh from from experience i mean i train i travel all the time and i teach so many people that are very successful and so many people that are not and my job is to look at the dog and look at the person and tell them if they have that predisposition to to be what they want to be because i've been there and i know what it takes and i know what it takes from the dog and what it takes for the personality you know like you you have to know how to deal with stress you have to you have to be super like yeah it's a it's such a combination it's such a package but a lot of times people don't want to hear it um and what happens also is when somebody says that you cannot then next one tells you oh i can make it and of course it's uh this is a big problem in in the whole society not just doctrine of you know that there is money to be made and there is always both ways you know somebody that wants to and somebody that tells them that they can and you know it goes on that way um i know people that are they have spent 20 years they have went through maybe 15 dogs and they're still where they are but they still have that idea that they're gonna something great is coming ahead of them

45:46

but they're getting frustrated and then the dogs are suffering because of that and i think it's really important to to recognize where you are and who you really can be and i don't think it's hard but you gotta gotta kinda push out the noise around you because it's always very misleading deep inside you know who you are like you really know like if i know i know the interest in ice skating i mean i like ice skating as but i wouldn't do figure skating it's just no interest for me but i know kids that would love to do it i would like to fight or you know so another thing with genetics real quick um you can let's say let's say there is a uh some fighting sport let's say boxing or ufc or whatever and there is a champion and he's been champion for quite some time but he starts to realize that there is there are better competitors than him and the moment that comes in your head you know that you're not gonna be able to win because you're starting to fight or compete against somebody that has nothing to lose and has a very strong will and believe in himself that they are like let's say they're in the rankings tenth or something like that they're like no i'm really good i i can definitely get up there to where the one that it's already on the top and it's starts to feel that there is better than him then they start to avoid the competitions then there is all the excuses and and ultimately that's kind of how it gets changed um but when you have the the where i'm going with that story is that some something very interesting can happen to to a kid or a dog like when when we talk genetics so in a kit example it's like we can pump and pump the kid up and we can tell him hey you really you can be the best tennis player in the world right now we just need to keep going strong every other day and we hire this trainer for that and that and that and what really happens again it's it's an innate as a person or as a dog you know what you can and what you cannot do but when they push you in that place that you have to perform and meet that um expectations that's been built up and you know you cannot meet it what happens is actually quite the opposite you shut down you start to go back and you start to look at excuses why you not gonna do it today or next month or next year so instead of you know parents and trainers think that they they really really want to build up something it actually goes the other way around to give you an example with dogs and let's let's take protection training for example any protection sports so if the puppy or the dog is afraid or has some reservation some awareness of a stick yet so that that's i don't know if i can handle that

49:35

so as a trainer you you have an option to say i'm gonna go through this whole program and i'm gonna convince you that it's not gonna hurt and i'm gonna touch you and we're gonna play and we're gonna spend so much time and we're gonna counter condition and all these names and procedures we're gonna use on you and sure eventually you're gonna convince the puppy or the dog that that's not gonna hurt until the day comes that actually he gets stopped and it hurts and now he's not prepared and everything just crumbles in an instant all this hard work and all this magic it just goes out just like that because the approach is wrong so the only approach to to be successful is to see how far those genetics can pull through instead of trying to fool the dog or the kid that this not gonna hurt or this whatever no it can hurt but maybe you can overcome it maybe that's how you will go through and so training um as i said there is like almost two really distinctive different parts of approaches to training and most trainers are very busy to teach behaviors completely disregard emotions and emotions are super critical because without emotion how you feel about doing something do you like to do it or do you not like to do it do you feel comfort confident that you're good at it or you feel that you're forced to do emotions is probably the more important thing than the actual behavior but as a typical trainer everybody is preoccupied being with a clicker being with the electric working level color but it's all about behaviors it's a sit come back go to a place whatever how the dog feels what is the motivation it's almost so secondary that and eventually it just surfaces there is no way that it wouldn't and and then it becomes apparent how important it is and some trainers may come out of it and change and some just do more of what they normally do but that's that's genetics i can really talk so much about it so it's interesting before you went into the the specific stories like the um the twins or the triplets um i i would think you know you going to different countries and working with people that um you don't speak the same language that that would kind of give you um uh a way to communicate with someone or an animal uh like on an on an emotional level like you don't have to actually hear them talking you can kind of see them like a movie body language yeah that's a very good point that actually i will add feeling a little more to this because uh again something like um i i'm super super big on play like i place the most important thing as far as i'm concerned as an interaction with dogs um there is trainers that especially like agility trainers still

53:15

will fill up a toy with treats to teach the dog to play which is completely mind-blowing i mean it's ridiculous um there is the marine sea world type of trainers um they also they there's a whole wave of trainers that believe that play is something that you teach something that becomes you know reinforced with a primary reinforcement and therefore starts the dog starts to like and play is a super important biological need like we just like we come ready and you know primary reinforcers food sex um sleep all this um avoid discomfort plays the same thing it's a it's an innate biological programming that that we come with especially mammals and all mammals come with that very few humans dogs for sure never it never gets old it's not like you can see a cow playing ball you can see like if you go on youtube you can see uh a dolphin on the open completely random dolphin and some rugby players from australia tossing a rugby ball and the dolphin is doing fetch without no i mean obviously a wild animal you know so we all mammals specifically are really really ready to play as youngsters but as they grow up it kind of goes away but play if you deprive a kid from play you will you will not develop correctly if you uh um dogs people we we can play and we can come up with endless like there is an infinite number of games that you can come up with you will never be able to say okay i cannot come up with another game there is always gonna be like a game that you can come up with and that's to tell you how prepared you are to play what play does it teaches cooperation trust i mean when we're talking about building relationship and engagement and all these things that trainers you know cliche words with how we do with the food when you play you actually build on this and you don't need language you can like if a kid is good at playing soccer and he has a confidence that it's good it's not uh made up from his parents telling him he actually knows he is good you can you can take any american kid and throw him in the favelas in brazil and he would know nobody and it would be the scariest neighborhood ever and within five minutes he will be playing with the kids soccer that's how powerful games are and and kind of that's why i interrupted you because my passion and love for dogs was recognized by other people elsewhere in the world immediately and the connections and interactions were just they just kept rolling because of that so it's a very similar thing i i actually uh got your i think it was the for the first video i watched of yours was the focused healing video and um that completely changed the way that i interact with rika with my

57:02

belgian malinois who's a year old um really making everything a game and it's made just the whole training experience so much better like more fun more uh exciting and it's not so um like i feel like i'm using my imagination more yeah for you for sure are and that's exactly there is like a door opens up to where the interaction goes both ways and it's perfectly understood but both of you and the intentions and the emotions to where there is no way you can accomplish something like this in in any other way yeah oh um i want to also ask you where do you see the future of dog training going yeah so that's a that's a big one that's bigger than genetics um yeah i i try to stay optimistic i try to think that eventually we we can do we can train dogs in a better way we can treat them with respect and somehow unite in in all different areas of like old dog lovers like you know and and protect each other from the animal rights and there's just people that really don't want us to have dogs and they are winning and they're winning because we're splitting and we're fighting these little fights like five people from this and five people from there it's like all new york not a good trainer because you're following this ideology and you're something and of course there is truths to that but uh there is a much bigger picture and we gotta we need to try to stay on track and and support each other and at the same time though i'm very much against um the there is always that approach of i'm gonna tell you that you're a great trainer and i expect that you tell me that i'm a great trainer and then you're gonna tell him that i'm not that great because i'm doing this and this but then we're gonna meet again and we have so there is a lot of shady interactions between us and when when i i wish that when somebody sees bad training they call it and it doesn't matter who it is um if that doesn't happen i i don't see how we move forward and the reason like competitions are very cool when we have competitions they're kind of like um you know like science scientists they go to the lab and they do their experiments and they do their findings in dog training you have competitions and the the competition field is basically the lab and this is where you know you you talk the talk and then you walk the walk it's not on the keyboard and it's not how many followers you have and it's not um but it's a very interesting time with the social media because um it's very easy to to become famous without a base and then and then yeah you start to teach and you don't know

1:00:57

and there is a it's a it's kind of strange situation because uh there is not as astrophysic really smart guy uh neil degrasse tyson he has a super cool quote let me see if i can remember it right now um a great challenge in life it's that you oh man i'm not go i'm gonna butcher it but it's basically you think that you know so you know a topic well enough but you just don't know that you don't know and if you stay in a bubble you always gonna think high of yourself and you will not dare to check yourself but unless you check yourself you have no progress you have no evolution as as a trainer then even even if you have so many followers and and make people believe and and you believe in yourself but you don't go and you check yourself and see where where where is my lane let's say there is 80 dogs that are going to compete and i'm gonna go and i'm gonna get ready and i will see if my dog and all the [ __ ] that i make up in my head actually where it stands with everything a lot of people that's why they train and compete and a lot of people that's the reason why they avoid it um and we don't have like you know in in that industry like having certification is a very easy thing right i mean it's laughable you don't need certification you can start your dog business tomorrow like there's just so such simple steps you you make just two page website you put that google ad you make the social media and you get your first client tomorrow guaranteed but if you truly want to be somebody and you want to be good at what you do and get the satisfaction because there's a whole different level of satisfaction when you actually are good at something and you're teaching something that he has value that you you're really giving something back that makes people grow it's not bullshitting people it's really worth it but there is you know like unless unless this happens we're stuck in this situation where we are right now um and ultimately yeah some people call it electric steam some people call it shock collar then you have it's it's ridiculous how we talk about each other and what we do and what we believe but we never can check everybody would avoid that unless they they feel that they're good or they don't mind where they are they're fine with who they are and where they are um other than that there is gonna be you know i don't know if that answers the question really it's a it's a tough one this is a always a very difficult one to talk about um like i again i i have really nothing to prove nothing in in no area of anything that i've done anything that i have thought of that i want to accomplish i have accomplished and i have

1:04:56

accomplished it a few times more um so like if i say well i don't need to compete right now why would i i mean i i've won since like 2000 till today i have won 15 championships so that means that there is five maybe i didn't have a dog that was on transition whatever it was and then i had won a world championship and then i did it again and i can i can completely stop and just say i'm the greatest but what's the point like if you if you stop yourself like that then you don't progress then then the only if you're not going up you're going down right you're just gonna end up watching tv needing doritos and and eventually just kind of die a boring life but the reason i go and compete is because i always think of different ways how i can stimulate a dog how i can interact with a dog how would that what i'm trying to teach and work with how is it going to perform is it going to stand the pressure of all the other competitors and and being innovative and like this is what it's about you know so absolutely i've been thank you so much for sharing everything that you've shared and also inspiring me and everyone that's watching and just the dog world in general you're welcome it was fun hopefully everybody that listens go after your dreams don't don't sit back challenge yourself it's okay to lose it's okay to fall down if you don't fall down you're not gonna get up and go forward you're just gonna stay as most of the people do so dream high i'm good example make it happen yes thank you thank you ivan yeah see you

0:03

we are honored to have mr ivan balabanov we are honored to have mr ivan balabanov join us join us join us ivan has revolutionized the world of dog ivan has revolutionized the world of dog ivan has revolutionized the world of dog sports sports sports dog training genetics breeding dog training genetics breeding dog training genetics breeding um and we are very very um and we are very very um and we are very very honored to have him on today to talk honored to have him on today to talk honored to have him on today to talk about about about hopefully all of those topics and hopefully all of those topics and hopefully all of those topics and hopefully we'll cover some of the hopefully we'll cover some of the hopefully we'll cover some of the benefits of benefits of benefits of play and possession games and chasing play and possession games and chasing play and possession games and chasing catch catch catch just invited five minutes hope you guys just invited five minutes hope you guys just invited five minutes hope you guys are all great hey hello i made it yes hey hello i made it yes i'm good how are you that's not easy i'm good how are you that's not easy i'm good how are you that's not easy that's my first that's my first that's my first instagram live yay instagram live yay instagram live yay okay so okay so okay so um how are you doing tonight um how are you doing tonight um how are you doing tonight it's good it's been busy very busy it's good it's been busy very busy it's good it's been busy very busy like just like everybody else probably like just like everybody else probably like just like everybody else probably but but but he had to go to hong kong that's why we he had to go to hong kong that's why we he had to go to hong kong that's why we had to cancel postponed the other one had to cancel postponed the other one had to cancel postponed the other one and and and just a lot of dog training and moving just a lot of dog training and moving just a lot of dog training and moving dogs that are stuck here because of the dogs that are stuck here because of the dogs that are stuck here because of the virus and virus and virus and then we have the whole school that i run then we have the whole school that i run then we have the whole school that i run for dog trainers so there is a we're for dog trainers so there is a we're for dog trainers so there is a we're very close to getting them certified so very close to getting them certified so very close to getting them certified so it's like busy because these are always it's like busy because these are always it's like busy because these are always good good

1:23

good a lot of stuff going on cool a lot of stuff going on cool a lot of stuff going on cool so ivan can you um give us a rundown so ivan can you um give us a rundown so ivan can you um give us a rundown you've been doing this a really long you've been doing this a really long you've been doing this a really long time time time and you have household name you've and you have household name you've and you have household name you've revolutionized revolutionized revolutionized the industry and um i would love for you the industry and um i would love for you the industry and um i would love for you to talk about your background and how it to talk about your background and how it to talk about your background and how it all started all started all started oh that that can be a very long oh that that can be a very long oh that that can be a very long instagram live um so instagram live um so instagram live um so gosh yeah i mean it's more than 40 years gosh yeah i mean it's more than 40 years gosh yeah i mean it's more than 40 years it's probably it's probably it's probably i don't know i mean when i first and it i don't know i mean when i first and it i don't know i mean when i first and it depends where i really would count depends where i really would count depends where i really would count when i started anything dogs when i started anything dogs when i started anything dogs or when i decided that i want to be a or when i decided that i want to be a or when i decided that i want to be a professional dog trainer so there is a professional dog trainer so there is a professional dog trainer so there is a lot of lot of lot of but i i would say somewhere in the maybe but i i would say somewhere in the maybe but i i would say somewhere in the maybe early 80s is when i early 80s is when i early 80s is when i was pretty sure that that's what i want was pretty sure that that's what i want was pretty sure that that's what i want to do and at the time i was living in to do and at the time i was living in to do and at the time i was living in bulgaria bulgaria bulgaria which was uh a communist country which which was uh a communist country which which was uh a communist country which means means means you cannot just get a ticket and fly you cannot just get a ticket and fly you cannot just get a ticket and fly somewhere somewhere somewhere to train dogs and there was no youtube to train dogs and there was no youtube to train dogs and there was no youtube of course there was no social media so of course there was no social media so of course there was no social media so you had to really you had to really

2:38

you had to really find really different ways how to find really different ways how to find really different ways how to do what you like to do and um yeah it do what you like to do and um yeah it do what you like to do and um yeah it was uh was uh was uh i basically took a really really big i basically took a really really big i basically took a really really big risk risk risk and just escape the country and just escape the country and just escape the country with the with the idea that maybe i'm with the with the idea that maybe i'm with the with the idea that maybe i'm gonna get caught gonna get caught gonna get caught and if i get caught maybe i'll get shot and if i get caught maybe i'll get shot and if i get caught maybe i'll get shot or or or work in some mind and nobody will ever work in some mind and nobody will ever work in some mind and nobody will ever see me see me see me but you know being young and crazy and but you know being young and crazy and but you know being young and crazy and determined that that's determined that that's determined that that's that was my life that's what i wanted to that was my life that's what i wanted to that was my life that's what i wanted to do so i left everything behind do so i left everything behind do so i left everything behind and chased my dream and chased my dream and chased my dream and it happened you know so from there and it happened you know so from there and it happened you know so from there i went to i went to belgium i went to i went to belgium i went to i went to belgium and that was um so back in bulgaria was and that was um so back in bulgaria was and that was um so back in bulgaria was doing some doing some doing some it's kind of like a like a psa it's kind of like a like a psa it's kind of like a like a psa type of sport uh it's a russian military type of sport uh it's a russian military type of sport uh it's a russian military sport sport sport um so i was um so i was um so i was i i just had that talent and desire to i i just had that talent and desire to i i just had that talent and desire to do so do so do so it like within a year or two it like within a year or two it like within a year or two there was just no competition it became there was just no competition it became there was just no competition it became really boring for me so i was like really boring for me so i was like really boring for me so i was like i need to do something i know i'm good i need to do something i know i'm good i need to do something i know i'm good at this i know i like to do it so at this i know i like to do it so

3:59

at this i know i like to do it so then i went to belgium and that was um yeah like i'd say 88 or something like yeah like i'd say 88 or something like that it's 88.89 that it's 88.89 that it's 88.89 um i got my first malinois um i got my first malinois um i got my first malinois i wanted a malinois i knew that i wanted i wanted a malinois i knew that i wanted i wanted a malinois i knew that i wanted malinois but all i knew about them was malinois but all i knew about them was malinois but all i knew about them was at the time just a picture from a at the time just a picture from a at the time just a picture from a magazine magazine magazine and dog trainers talking about them so when i first saw them you know i was so when i first saw them you know i was um um um i mean i was so convinced that i'm gonna i mean i was so convinced that i'm gonna i mean i was so convinced that i'm gonna have one that it really didn't matter have one that it really didn't matter have one that it really didn't matter what i would see what i would see what i would see and the first one that i saw it was very and the first one that i saw it was very and the first one that i saw it was very funny because funny because funny because he he had like this crazy overbite i he he had like this crazy overbite i he he had like this crazy overbite i mean he really looked like a parrot you mean he really looked like a parrot you mean he really looked like a parrot you know know know but it was a cool dog and i was like but it was a cool dog and i was like but it was a cool dog and i was like that's that's what i want that's that's what i want that's that's what i want so from there um i started so from there um i started so from there um i started you know naturally from the that kind of you know naturally from the that kind of you know naturally from the that kind of military military military training i did i moved into the bell training i did i moved into the bell training i did i moved into the bell generating programs generating programs generating programs and yeah i was fortunate enough to and yeah i was fortunate enough to and yeah i was fortunate enough to to meet some of the legends to meet some of the legends to meet some of the legends i mean as far as dogs and trainers at i mean as far as dogs and trainers at i mean as far as dogs and trainers at the time the time the time um so it really you know like all my um so it really you know like all my um so it really you know like all my risk that i took and all this care that risk that i took and all this care that risk that i took and all this care that i i

5:23

i had to go through it really really paid had to go through it really really paid had to go through it really really paid off like almost off like almost off like almost right away i was like yeah no that right away i was like yeah no that right away i was like yeah no that that's what you want to do that's what you want to do that's what you want to do and so yeah as far as malin was that was and so yeah as far as malin was that was and so yeah as far as malin was that was a a a very very special time because it wasn't very very special time because it wasn't very very special time because it wasn't just bulgaria i mean most of the world just bulgaria i mean most of the world just bulgaria i mean most of the world didn't know much about them um besides didn't know much about them um besides didn't know much about them um besides the the the ring circles the french ring and the ring circles the french ring and the ring circles the french ring and the belgian ring and the belgian ring and the belgian ring and the dutch sports kmpv and so on but other dutch sports kmpv and so on but other dutch sports kmpv and so on but other than that than that than that they were they were not that popular if they were they were not that popular if they were they were not that popular if if at all if at all if at all um so i i pretty much grew up um so i i pretty much grew up um so i i pretty much grew up in the dog training world in the dog training world in the dog training world along with the malinois the popularity along with the malinois the popularity along with the malinois the popularity um um um so i got my first one in belgium and so i got my first one in belgium and so i got my first one in belgium and uh like i made some connections i made uh like i made some connections i made uh like i made some connections i made some friends some friends some friends so it was the so it was the so it was the the kennel name is the diopua so i don't the kennel name is the diopua so i don't the kennel name is the diopua so i don't know it's like people that are really know it's like people that are really know it's like people that are really really really really into the breed they that would say a lot into the breed they that would say a lot into the breed they that would say a lot to them to them to them people that are studying or not familiar people that are studying or not familiar people that are studying or not familiar with the breed that probably will be with the breed that probably will be with the breed that probably will be a name that they have heard that doesn't a name that they have heard that doesn't

6:35

a name that they have heard that doesn't mean much to them but um mean much to them but um mean much to them but um that specific channel was uh probably that specific channel was uh probably that specific channel was uh probably single-handedly like what made the breed single-handedly like what made the breed single-handedly like what made the breed boom in the 90s and the late 80s boom in the 90s and the late 80s boom in the 90s and the late 80s um so yeah i i got to meet um so yeah i i got to meet um so yeah i i got to meet the breeder his name's uh luke vance the the breeder his name's uh luke vance the the breeder his name's uh luke vance the brush that's a brush that's a brush that's a kind of lives in a french part of the kind of lives in a french part of the kind of lives in a french part of the country country country and i told him that i want to do sports and i told him that i want to do sports and i told him that i want to do sports and want to compete in a high level and want to compete in a high level and want to compete in a high level and he's he got excited it was and he's he got excited it was and he's he got excited it was for me like when i moved to belgium i for me like when i moved to belgium i for me like when i moved to belgium i didn't even didn't even didn't even speak english i didn't so it was pretty speak english i didn't so it was pretty speak english i didn't so it was pretty hard hard hard in the beginning but on top of that he in the beginning but on top of that he in the beginning but on top of that he only speaks french so we were like just only speaks french so we were like just only speaks french so we were like just sign language and and having always sign language and and having always sign language and and having always somebody to help us somebody to help us somebody to help us translate but um there was a really translate but um there was a really translate but um there was a really funny story funny story funny story that when i decided to get my first that when i decided to get my first that when i decided to get my first puppy puppy puppy and i go to him and he knows and i go to him and he knows and i go to him and he knows that i'm going to get a puppy and that i'm going to get a puppy and that i'm going to get a puppy and we see them it's kind of typical for at we see them it's kind of typical for at we see them it's kind of typical for at least at the time least at the time least at the time in belgium you go when you talk dogs but in belgium you go when you talk dogs but in belgium you go when you talk dogs but you you you sit down have some beers drink and talk

7:52

sit down have some beers drink and talk sit down have some beers drink and talk so it was good time so it was good time so it was good time and then there is this little nice dark and then there is this little nice dark and then there is this little nice dark male puppy that's male puppy that's male puppy that's maybe nine weeks old just walking around maybe nine weeks old just walking around maybe nine weeks old just walking around the room and i can't the room and i can't the room and i can't get my eyes off of it i mean it's like get my eyes off of it i mean it's like get my eyes off of it i mean it's like the most gorgeous puppy the most gorgeous puppy the most gorgeous puppy i've seen i'm like i want this one i've seen i'm like i want this one i've seen i'm like i want this one and the guy is like no that's and the guy is like no that's and the guy is like no that's just not that's just a another topic for just not that's just a another topic for just not that's just a another topic for work work work and now i really thought that he's just and now i really thought that he's just and now i really thought that he's just trying to think that i'm not gonna be trying to think that i'm not gonna be trying to think that i'm not gonna be good enough for that puppy or something good enough for that puppy or something good enough for that puppy or something you know but anyway we wait so he's like okay i'm but anyway we wait so he's like okay i'm gonna bring you the dog that i have in gonna bring you the dog that i have in gonna bring you the dog that i have in mind and he brings me this one female mind and he brings me this one female mind and he brings me this one female and she's already like probably four and she's already like probably four and she's already like probably four four and a half months old i mean it's four and a half months old i mean it's four and a half months old i mean it's like not that it's still a puppy but like not that it's still a puppy but like not that it's still a puppy but it's a it's a it's a older puppy down the typical eight week older puppy down the typical eight week older puppy down the typical eight week old one old one old one and she has this big white chest and and she has this big white chest and and she has this big white chest and white feet and white feet and white feet and it just completely something that i it just completely something that i it just completely something that i didn't think didn't think didn't think a female and an older and all this white a female and an older and all this white

8:58

a female and an older and all this white on her and i'm like no i don't want this on her and i'm like no i don't want this on her and i'm like no i don't want this talk talk talk like we were like and so we had a like we were like and so we had a like we were like and so we had a really really big like debates really really big like debates really really big like debates conversations like conversations like conversations like i mean almost at the point that i see i mean almost at the point that i see i mean almost at the point that i see he's getting upset that me he's getting upset that me he's getting upset that me and i'm getting upset at him and i'm getting upset at him and i'm getting upset at him and finally like my friends trying to and finally like my friends trying to and finally like my friends trying to translate it translate it translate it put a piece in that whole discussion you put a piece in that whole discussion you put a piece in that whole discussion you know know know because i'm so convinced that i want because i'm so convinced that i want because i'm so convinced that i want this one and he's like this one and he's like this one and he's like if you're gonna do sport that's the dog if you're gonna do sport that's the dog if you're gonna do sport that's the dog you should take you should take you should take and so he was so cool that eventually and so he was so cool that eventually and so he was so cool that eventually what happened what happened what happened he told me okay you take both take the he told me okay you take both take the he told me okay you take both take the puppy that you like take the female puppy that you like take the female puppy that you like take the female and in two weeks you're gonna bring one and in two weeks you're gonna bring one and in two weeks you're gonna bring one back whatever whichever one you do back whatever whichever one you do back whatever whichever one you do so of course i mean within three days i so of course i mean within three days i so of course i mean within three days i knew knew knew which one so i kept the female which one so i kept the female which one so i kept the female and that was kind of how i started um and that was kind of how i started um and that was kind of how i started um she she she she she she ended up being my um uh foundation ended up being my um uh foundation ended up being my um uh foundation female for my kennel dude with shamalino female for my kennel dude with shamalino female for my kennel dude with shamalino and we had the first the first puppies and we had the first the first puppies

10:07

and we had the first the first puppies was uh was uh was uh 1989 or 90. 1989 or 90. 1989 or 90. um so then from there i i was really from there i i was really this was the time when monday rings this was the time when monday rings this was the time when monday rings started to started to started to basically monitoring got basically monitoring got basically monitoring got introduced and there was the french ring introduced and there was the french ring introduced and there was the french ring sport people the belgian ring sport sport people the belgian ring sport sport people the belgian ring sport people people people some germans but not that many of course some germans but not that many of course some germans but not that many of course the dutch the dutch the dutch crowd and they will meet and they will crowd and they will meet and they will crowd and they will meet and they will make demonstrations and they will get in make demonstrations and they will get in make demonstrations and they will get in all these all these all these fights of which program is better and fights of which program is better and fights of which program is better and which exercise which exercise which exercise from this one should go there and that was a very interesting time in the that was a very interesting time in the history of the sports history of the sports history of the sports um eventually i decided i'm gonna move um eventually i decided i'm gonna move um eventually i decided i'm gonna move to the states for no apparent reason to the states for no apparent reason to the states for no apparent reason like i didn't know nobody like i didn't know nobody like i didn't know nobody i didn't know where i'm gonna go but i didn't know where i'm gonna go but i didn't know where i'm gonna go but somehow belgium just somehow belgium just somehow belgium just started to be very small for me like started to be very small for me like started to be very small for me like you know in my head like really no you know in my head like really no you know in my head like really no reason for it reason for it reason for it and so i started kind of do some and so i started kind of do some and so i started kind of do some research and research and research and i hear that there is a possibility that i hear that there is a possibility that i hear that there is a possibility that you can you can you can get a job as a dog trainer like actually get a job as a dog trainer like actually get a job as a dog trainer like actually you know getting paid to train dogs you know getting paid to train dogs you know getting paid to train dogs which which

11:30

which at that time in europe was something at that time in europe was something at that time in europe was something people would laugh at people would laugh at people would laugh at even when i was leaving bulgaria my mom even when i was leaving bulgaria my mom even when i was leaving bulgaria my mom would be like you would be like you would be like you hopefully you get a job soon because hopefully you get a job soon because hopefully you get a job soon because these dogs that's not gonna be these dogs that's not gonna be these dogs that's not gonna be you know you're not gonna be good like you know you're not gonna be good like you know you're not gonna be good like that that that um and so anyway um and so anyway um and so anyway went to the move to the states it was uh went to the move to the states it was uh went to the move to the states it was uh it was pretty much san diego los angeles or san francisco san diego los angeles or san francisco for no reason like really for no reason for no reason like really for no reason for no reason like really for no reason and eventually ended up in san francisco and eventually ended up in san francisco and eventually ended up in san francisco because it just somehow sounded better because it just somehow sounded better because it just somehow sounded better to me at the moment to me at the moment to me at the moment um so i started to look for jobs and um so i started to look for jobs and um so i started to look for jobs and and i was not really thinking i'm going and i was not really thinking i'm going and i was not really thinking i'm going to get a job as a doctor you know to get a job as a doctor you know to get a job as a doctor you know um i'm like i was pretty good um i'm like i was pretty good um i'm like i was pretty good electrician at the time electrician at the time electrician at the time and so i'm walking around trying to find and so i'm walking around trying to find and so i'm walking around trying to find some job some job some job and i see trainers with guide dogs and i see trainers with guide dogs and i see trainers with guide dogs walking around walking around walking around on a street so i start following them on a street so i start following them on a street so i start following them and then i see them getting loading the and then i see them getting loading the and then i see them getting loading the dogs in a van and i just dogs in a van and i just dogs in a van and i just ran to my car and i just really followed ran to my car and i just really followed ran to my car and i just really followed them to to the guido school

12:45

them to to the guido school them to to the guido school in san rafael in california and yeah i i'm like okay i need to i i yeah i i'm like okay i need to i i want to get a job here whatever job it want to get a job here whatever job it want to get a job here whatever job it is is is but i'm going to work my way and i'm but i'm going to work my way and i'm but i'm going to work my way and i'm going to train dogs here going to train dogs here going to train dogs here it was you know um it was you know um it was you know um so they they kind of laughed at me but so they they kind of laughed at me but so they they kind of laughed at me but appreciated their enthusiasm i guess appreciated their enthusiasm i guess appreciated their enthusiasm i guess they're like well we don't have jobs they're like well we don't have jobs they're like well we don't have jobs right now and there is a process and right now and there is a process and right now and there is a process and you know we have applications and just you know we have applications and just you know we have applications and just kind of being very nice saying kind of being very nice saying kind of being very nice saying that it's not gonna work that it's not gonna work that it's not gonna work um but they were curious i mean like the accent they were curious i mean like the accent that i have now that i have now that i have now it was pretty much the same so it was it was pretty much the same so it was it was pretty much the same so it was interesting for them that it's okay it's interesting for them that it's okay it's interesting for them that it's okay it's a foreigner and a foreigner and a foreigner and and it's a dog person so i was like well and it's a dog person so i was like well and it's a dog person so i was like well what kind of what kind of what kind of dog training you do and what is the dog training you do and what is the dog training you do and what is the methods do you know this book or methods do you know this book or methods do you know this book or this just all this old school american this just all this old school american this just all this old school american dog training booths that i've never dog training booths that i've never dog training booths that i've never heard of of course because heard of of course because heard of of course because i didn't grow up here like no i don't i didn't grow up here like no i don't i didn't grow up here like no i don't know but know but know but i'm sure i can do better i just always i'm sure i can do better i just always i'm sure i can do better i just always had a very had a very

14:02

had a very big confidence and big mouth um big confidence and big mouth um big confidence and big mouth um so to to make it a little short day so to to make it a little short day so to to make it a little short day i went i went back home i mean it was i went i went back home i mean it was i went i went back home i mean it was kind of like kind of like kind of like i i didn't give up but they said yeah i i didn't give up but they said yeah i i didn't give up but they said yeah we will call you at some point but we will call you at some point but we will call you at some point but pretty much trying to tell me that pretty much trying to tell me that pretty much trying to tell me that it's just not gonna work out but next it's just not gonna work out but next it's just not gonna work out but next thing you know like three days later the thing you know like three days later the thing you know like three days later the training director of the school calls me training director of the school calls me training director of the school calls me he's like well he's like well he's like well do you want to come we want to test you do you want to come we want to test you do you want to come we want to test you like of course i wanted to make me like like of course i wanted to make me like like of course i wanted to make me like what time what time what time and so i went and then they did and and so i went and then they did and and so i went and then they did and yeah i ended up taking getting the job yeah i ended up taking getting the job yeah i ended up taking getting the job and went through their whole program and went through their whole program and went through their whole program being an apprentice and instructor and being an apprentice and instructor and being an apprentice and instructor and so on so on so on um and that was really good for me um and that was really good for me um and that was really good for me in one hand because i really i didn't in one hand because i really i didn't in one hand because i really i didn't know anybody i didn't have any know anybody i didn't have any know anybody i didn't have any you know like credit card history or you know like credit card history or you know like credit card history or anything like this you know and that was anything like this you know and that was anything like this you know and that was a very very well paid job and very a very very well paid job and very a very very well paid job and very secure job secure job secure job so it was just beautiful how things were so it was just beautiful how things were

15:09

so it was just beautiful how things were working out always working out always working out always you know it's one of those things that you know it's one of those things that you know it's one of those things that as as as bob marley says where there is a will bob marley says where there is a will bob marley says where there is a will there is a way there is a way there is a way and so and so and so but it was very demanding job i learned but it was very demanding job i learned but it was very demanding job i learned so much there so much there so much there i also told them so much i also told them so much i also told them so much and there were so many stories and there were so many stories and there were so many stories from from the school at the time like from from the school at the time like from from the school at the time like it was very typical you know traditional training i mean you you know traditional training i mean you cannot the the cannot the the cannot the the best you can do is maybe praise the dog best you can do is maybe praise the dog best you can do is maybe praise the dog a little bit but a little bit but a little bit but forget about playing or giving them a forget about playing or giving them a forget about playing or giving them a treat or something you know it was a treat or something you know it was a treat or something you know it was a very very very like a you know really traditional style like a you know really traditional style like a you know really traditional style old school but that was really really old school but that was really really old school but that was really really really really good experience really really good experience really really good experience um like when i teach um like when i teach um like when i teach in my school right now i have so many in my school right now i have so many in my school right now i have so many stories and so many stories and so many stories and so many examples of of how to examples of of how to examples of of how to train dogs and and yeah like train dogs and and yeah like train dogs and and yeah like it always always comes to mind eventually though i had to you know i eventually though i had to you know i got on my feet got on my feet got on my feet and unfortunately i couldn't compete and unfortunately i couldn't compete and unfortunately i couldn't compete at the time because of the schedule of at the time because of the schedule of at the time because of the schedule of the school the school always had a very the school the school always had a very the school the school always had a very rigid rigid

16:37

rigid just like just like any school you know just like just like any school you know just like just like any school you know this is when the students will come this this is when the students will come this this is when the students will come this is when they're gonna go is when they're gonna go is when they're gonna go home now you have vacation and if it home now you have vacation and if it home now you have vacation and if it happens that there is some competition happens that there is some competition happens that there is some competition great i was always out of luck great i was always out of luck great i was always out of luck like all the big competitions for five like all the big competitions for five like all the big competitions for five years i could not go to years i could not go to years i could not go to it was really frustrating on on that end it was really frustrating on on that end it was really frustrating on on that end of of of things so then i was okay things so then i was okay things so then i was okay i will move on to something else so then i will move on to something else so then i will move on to something else so then i went back to san francisco and i got a i went back to san francisco and i got a i went back to san francisco and i got a job at the job at the job at the spca the san francisco spca spca the san francisco spca spca the san francisco spca and that was a that was a also very and that was a that was a also very and that was a that was a also very interesting job because interesting job because interesting job because it was the first nokia shelter in the it was the first nokia shelter in the it was the first nokia shelter in the world world world at the time and at the time and at the time and that's early 90s and in early 90s there that's early 90s and in early 90s there that's early 90s and in early 90s there was a lot of was a lot of was a lot of people fighting underground like a lot people fighting underground like a lot people fighting underground like a lot in the area in the area in the area so they will do all sorts of riots and so they will do all sorts of riots and so they will do all sorts of riots and bring just bring just bring just 20 50 60 dogs and yeah it was a very interesting yeah it was a very interesting experience to to work there experience to to work there experience to to work there but it also allowed me to have free time but it also allowed me to have free time but it also allowed me to have free time and do and do and do the things that i wanted to do with my the things that i wanted to do with my the things that i wanted to do with my own dogs

17:53

own dogs own dogs so then i started to do more and more so then i started to do more and more so then i started to do more and more club training and competitions club training and competitions club training and competitions and people started to see that there is and people started to see that there is and people started to see that there is something different that i do something different that i do something different that i do and of course the interest kept growing and of course the interest kept growing and of course the interest kept growing to the point that i literally was forced to the point that i literally was forced to the point that i literally was forced to stop my job to stop my job to stop my job because i just had so many clients and because i just had so many clients and because i just had so many clients and so many places that i can make money so many places that i can make money so many places that i can make money that that that that that was impossible i am coming that that was impossible i am coming that that was impossible i am coming from from from you know from eastern europe um i i wouldn't even say middle class i i wouldn't even say middle class family family family we were pretty poor where i come from um we were pretty poor where i come from um we were pretty poor where i come from um so in my head it was always i have to so in my head it was always i have to so in my head it was always i have to work i have to make money you cannot say work i have to make money you cannot say work i have to make money you cannot say no to any client no to any client no to any client then the moment in time came to where it then the moment in time came to where it then the moment in time came to where it was you know was you know was you know i'm like no i i cannot not say no i'm like no i i cannot not say no i'm like no i i cannot not say no because i'm just gonna because i'm just gonna because i'm just gonna train myself like i will start to hate train myself like i will start to hate train myself like i will start to hate what i do what i do what i do so then i stopped so then i stopped so then i stopped the to work for anybody and then i the to work for anybody and then i the to work for anybody and then i started my own started my own started my own thing that was like i think 98 or 1999 thing that was like i think 98 or 1999 thing that was like i think 98 or 1999 um yeah and um yeah and um yeah and and that was also i mean talking back to and that was also i mean talking back to and that was also i mean talking back to with my parents and my friends with my parents and my friends

19:18

with my parents and my friends in europe and it's like oh no i just i'm in europe and it's like oh no i just i'm in europe and it's like oh no i just i'm training dogs training dogs training dogs and they're like you gotta and they're like you gotta and they're like you gotta start to think about your future you're start to think about your future you're start to think about your future you're gonna get old and you're not gonna gonna get old and you're not gonna gonna get old and you're not gonna whatever whatever whatever you might just slip me along you might just slip me along you might just slip me along and so from there and so from there and so from there a lot of competitions a lot of different a lot of competitions a lot of different a lot of competitions a lot of different you know you know you know um i still kept doing ring sport i still um i still kept doing ring sport i still um i still kept doing ring sport i still do i like it do i like it do i like it um we trained uh um we trained uh um we trained uh i mean the very first dog that went to i mean the very first dog that went to i mean the very first dog that went to the the the monde ring world championship was one of monde ring world championship was one of monde ring world championship was one of my breeding and my breeding and my breeding and trained from a puppy all the way trained from a puppy all the way trained from a puppy all the way by me so that was a pretty cool by me so that was a pretty cool by me so that was a pretty cool accomplishment i did with the female that i had i did i did with the female that i had i did uh uh uh i did some competitions but it was not i did some competitions but it was not i did some competitions but it was not easy because um again with the time that i have um again with the time that i have it was difficult to to find time to it was difficult to to find time to it was difficult to to find time to train train train so and what was interesting i was always making what was interesting i was always making my own my own my own training i always had my own ideas i training i always had my own ideas i training i always had my own ideas i always always always i always would look somebody training i always would look somebody training i always would look somebody training and i'm like okay i can do this better and i'm like okay i can do this better and i'm like okay i can do this better and i can better and i can do this and i can better and i can do this and i can better and i can do this better better better and and somehow it was happening yeah i and and somehow it was happening yeah i

20:48

and and somehow it was happening yeah i mean it wasn't just mean it wasn't just mean it wasn't just you know talking until eventually i you know talking until eventually i you know talking until eventually i started to started to started to see that well i would go to competitions see that well i would go to competitions see that well i would go to competitions in like in the late 90s i remember in like in the late 90s i remember in like in the late 90s i remember like in some san francisco that the like in some san francisco that the like in some san francisco that the whole bay area there like all the clubs they would not really like all the clubs they would not really want me to go to compete want me to go to compete want me to go to compete because they have their club trial they because they have their club trial they because they have their club trial they wanted wanted wanted their members do well and it just their members do well and it just their members do well and it just doesn't make sense for me to go and doesn't make sense for me to go and doesn't make sense for me to go and just take over you know so just take over you know so just take over you know so but we are good friends and i help them but we are good friends and i help them but we are good friends and i help them all the time all the time all the time but what we agreed on is that i always but what we agreed on is that i always but what we agreed on is that i always will enter the last dog in the trial so will enter the last dog in the trial so will enter the last dog in the trial so the judges don't have any the judges don't have any the judges don't have any criteria right from the beginning so criteria right from the beginning so criteria right from the beginning so um and then eventually i won i won my um and then eventually i won i won my um and then eventually i won i won my first national championship first national championship first national championship and what is cool about and what is cool about and what is cool about my accomplishments they're they're truly my accomplishments they're they're truly my accomplishments like i like i like i i dread my dogs i train my dogs the way i dread my dogs i train my dogs the way i dread my dogs i train my dogs the way i train not taking anything from i train not taking anything from i train not taking anything from anywhere anywhere anywhere and yeah so i won one competition and yeah so i won one competition and yeah so i won one competition then i won another one and then i don't then i won another one and then i don't then i won another one and then i don't know i probably have won

22:07

know i probably have won know i probably have won 15 or 16 national championships i won 15 or 16 national championships i won 15 or 16 national championships i won two world championships all with those two world championships all with those two world championships all with those that i breed all with those that i train that i breed all with those that i train that i breed all with those that i train um so then yeah from from then yeah from from california then i was like i wanted to california then i was like i wanted to california then i was like i wanted to really have more space really have more space really have more space we ended up training a lot of like it we ended up training a lot of like it we ended up training a lot of like it was a very beautiful area right by the was a very beautiful area right by the was a very beautiful area right by the golden gate bridge for anybody that golden gate bridge for anybody that golden gate bridge for anybody that lives around there lives around there lives around there uh presidio park presidio and uh presidio park presidio and uh presidio park presidio and i was working with all the police there i was working with all the police there i was working with all the police there so they would give me green light and we so they would give me green light and we so they would give me green light and we would train in this would train in this would train in this really just the most beautiful place in really just the most beautiful place in really just the most beautiful place in the world that the temperature is always the world that the temperature is always the world that the temperature is always 70 degrees no matter what 70 degrees no matter what 70 degrees no matter what month it is and then you have the ocean month it is and then you have the ocean month it is and then you have the ocean and you have the and you have the and you have the golden gate bridge and it's just like golden gate bridge and it's just like golden gate bridge and it's just like the really the really the really the paradise of places but it wasn't the paradise of places but it wasn't the paradise of places but it wasn't mine so i couldn't really mine so i couldn't really mine so i couldn't really i wanted to have something on my own and i wanted to have something on my own and i wanted to have something on my own and and that's kind of how i ended up in and that's kind of how i ended up in and that's kind of how i ended up in florida um so from there um so from there yeah very very much into breeding yeah very very much into breeding yeah very very much into breeding genetics training

23:16

genetics training genetics training science all of it science all of it science all of it awesome you have a lot to be proud of awesome you have a lot to be proud of awesome you have a lot to be proud of um i want to bring this uh wrap this um i want to bring this uh wrap this um i want to bring this uh wrap this into the genetics because it sounds like into the genetics because it sounds like into the genetics because it sounds like you are you have been you're genetically you are you have been you're genetically you are you have been you're genetically programmed to be very programmed to be very programmed to be very confident and go for it you know when confident and go for it you know when confident and go for it you know when with the with the with the the first malinois breeder you're the first malinois breeder you're the first malinois breeder you're telling the breeder hey i want this dog telling the breeder hey i want this dog telling the breeder hey i want this dog he's telling you you know take that dog he's telling you you know take that dog he's telling you you know take that dog and you're like and you're like and you're like no i want this or uh no i want this or uh no i want this or uh you know going to the different you know going to the different you know going to the different countries not knowing the language countries not knowing the language countries not knowing the language there's there's there's uh you have to be very confident to put uh you have to be very confident to put uh you have to be very confident to put yourself in that position yourself in that position yourself in that position how does it work with um the dogs that how does it work with um the dogs that how does it work with um the dogs that you you you select for your the sports and just how select for your the sports and just how select for your the sports and just how you go about breeding in general yeah my story with genetics it's a yeah my story with genetics it's a it's an interesting one um like when i when i really really got like when i when i really really got into it into it into it again coming coming with a background again coming coming with a background again coming coming with a background from from from military type of training in the 80s military type of training in the 80s military type of training in the 80s that's a pretty hardcore that's a pretty hardcore that's a pretty hardcore you know just young and crunk you know just young and crunk you know just young and crunk training and then um kind of the whole positive um kind of the whole positive training came in don't shoot the dog

24:52

training came in don't shoot the dog training came in don't shoot the dog came out came out came out karen pryor just blew everybody's minds karen pryor just blew everybody's minds karen pryor just blew everybody's minds away away away that positive reinforcement can do that positive reinforcement can do that positive reinforcement can do everything everything everything um so of course everybody jumped on the um so of course everybody jumped on the um so of course everybody jumped on the bandwagon i mean bandwagon i mean bandwagon i mean who wouldn't like if you if you really who wouldn't like if you if you really who wouldn't like if you if you really think that there is a better way why think that there is a better way why think that there is a better way why would you not would you not would you not regardless of what it is right so i regardless of what it is right so i regardless of what it is right so i spent um spent um spent um i spent a good three four years in it in i spent a good three four years in it in i spent a good three four years in it in fact the fact the fact the i wrote a book in the 90s late 90s so i wrote a book in the 90s late 90s so i wrote a book in the 90s late 90s so it's called advanced shoots contain it's called advanced shoots contain it's called advanced shoots contain a lot of the a lot of my views were a lot of the a lot of my views were a lot of the a lot of my views were still very much that the core was uh still very much that the core was uh still very much that the core was uh to use negative punishment and a lot of to use negative punishment and a lot of to use negative punishment and a lot of positive reinforcement positive reinforcement positive reinforcement and you know avoid the versa type of and you know avoid the versa type of and you know avoid the versa type of training training training but of course when you when you actually but of course when you when you actually but of course when you when you actually just just just um you don't want to just sound like oh um you don't want to just sound like oh um you don't want to just sound like oh this works better than something else this works better than something else this works better than something else but you actually have to be able to but you actually have to be able to but you actually have to be able to prove that it does prove that it does prove that it does and that proof always felt short and that proof always felt short and that proof always felt short and i was and i was and i was i'm extremely good trainer like i i'm extremely good trainer like i

26:10

i'm extremely good trainer like i you know i i don't have problems talking you know i i don't have problems talking you know i i don't have problems talking like this because i really am like this because i really am like this because i really am but if i cannot but if i cannot but if i cannot if i can use positive reinforcement and if i can use positive reinforcement and if i can use positive reinforcement and shaping shaping shaping and all this the whole ideology as and all this the whole ideology as and all this the whole ideology as it was booming at the time it was booming at the time it was booming at the time and i was not able to make the results and i was not able to make the results and i was not able to make the results that i want and i was seeing my dogs that i want and i was seeing my dogs that i want and i was seeing my dogs getting frustrated if anything even getting frustrated if anything even getting frustrated if anything even though though though you know we were avoiding compulsion and you know we were avoiding compulsion and you know we were avoiding compulsion and and things like that but and things like that but and things like that but um there was just a limitation um there was just a limitation um there was just a limitation and then there was another thing with and then there was another thing with and then there was another thing with that started to be a very problematic that started to be a very problematic that started to be a very problematic for me for me for me and again this i teach a lot on my and again this i teach a lot on my and again this i teach a lot on my modules at the school now for for the modules at the school now for for the modules at the school now for for the young young young people that learn um people that learn um people that learn um like like the whole skinnerian like like the whole skinnerian like like the whole skinnerian behaviorism and behaviorism and behaviorism and how basically how that how basically how that how basically how that ideology came up to today ideology came up to today ideology came up to today was you know there was a was you know there was a was you know there was a guy named watson and you know some guy named watson and you know some guy named watson and you know some people people people know some people don't but there was know some people don't but there was know some people don't but there was like a like a like a way back in time he had a very famous way back in time he had a very famous way back in time he had a very famous quote that quote that quote that he um you know the at the time they he um you know the at the time they

27:32

he um you know the at the time they believe that believe that believe that you can do anything you can accomplish you can do anything you can accomplish you can do anything you can accomplish absolutely anything absolutely anything absolutely anything through reinforcement and punishment through reinforcement and punishment through reinforcement and punishment i just a matter of studying with a i just a matter of studying with a i just a matter of studying with a so-called clean slate so-called clean slate so-called clean slate which they also believed so he had a which they also believed so he had a which they also believed so he had a very very very famous saying that it's still used today famous saying that it's still used today famous saying that it's still used today that um that um that um if you give me 10 young if you give me 10 young if you give me 10 young children i will make them whatever i children i will make them whatever i children i will make them whatever i want i'll make them want i'll make them want i'll make them a doctor or a thief you know just a doctor or a thief you know just a doctor or a thief you know just through that through that through that and of course now we know that that's and of course now we know that that's and of course now we know that that's not it just cannot happen that way not it just cannot happen that way not it just cannot happen that way and the reason it cannot happen is and the reason it cannot happen is and the reason it cannot happen is because of genetics because because of genetics because because of genetics because all of us actually come all of us actually come all of us actually come programmed with certain things programmed with certain things programmed with certain things you know like when we talk about primary you know like when we talk about primary you know like when we talk about primary reinforcers it's uh reinforcers it's uh reinforcers it's uh um we always think of certain things but um we always think of certain things but um we always think of certain things but one of the really one of the really one of the really cool things to to look at when you think cool things to to look at when you think cool things to to look at when you think of primary reinforcers is that of primary reinforcers is that of primary reinforcers is that it's uh something that it's innate it's uh something that it's innate it's uh something that it's innate something that you don't need to learn something that you don't need to learn something that you don't need to learn you're coming in at you're coming you're coming in at you're coming

28:41

you're coming in at you're coming on earth programmed on earth programmed on earth programmed ready to do it you know like like um yeah there's so many examples of this yeah there's so many examples of this but you know just just like how but you know just just like how but you know just just like how um a shark um a shark um a shark doesn't need to learn that it's a shark doesn't need to learn that it's a shark doesn't need to learn that it's a shark they they they they know they're shark um they know they're shark um they know they're shark um you know you when it's time for you to you know you when it's time for you to you know you when it's time for you to reproduce you know that it's time to reproduce you know that it's time to reproduce you know that it's time to reproduce reproduce reproduce you you don't need to learn you get you you don't need to learn you get you you don't need to learn you get better better better but you come programmed with certain but you come programmed with certain but you come programmed with certain things and uh as dog trainers things and uh as dog trainers things and uh as dog trainers that's uh somehow it's still that's uh somehow it's still that's uh somehow it's still uh cloudy area uh cloudy area uh cloudy area and especially young trainers and and especially young trainers and and especially young trainers and meaning not meaning not meaning not young trainers but uh trainers that are young trainers but uh trainers that are young trainers but uh trainers that are starting starting starting in the industry um in the industry um in the industry um of course some some very famous trainers of course some some very famous trainers of course some some very famous trainers as well as well as well unfortunately but every unfortunately but every unfortunately but every a lot of them think that um you can just just like watson said that you can just just like watson said that you can you can you can change behavior or guided change behavior or guided change behavior or guided through reinforcement and punishment and through reinforcement and punishment and through reinforcement and punishment and it's just not possible it's just not it's just not possible it's just not it's just not possible it's just not possible possible possible um certain um certain um certain behaviors that are in your genetic behaviors that are in your genetic behaviors that are in your genetic makeup makeup makeup you cannot you cannot change um you know you cannot you cannot change um you know you cannot you cannot change um you know like in like in like in in the early 80s whatever the whole gay

30:19

in the early 80s whatever the whole gay in the early 80s whatever the whole gay community community community of being in san francisco i heard all of being in san francisco i heard all of being in san francisco i heard all about it and and about it and and about it and and and i the interest in genetics and the and i the interest in genetics and the and i the interest in genetics and the whole reinforcement whole reinforcement whole reinforcement behaviorism um you know they were trying behaviorism um you know they were trying behaviorism um you know they were trying to do all sorts of things like they will to do all sorts of things like they will to do all sorts of things like they will show them show them show them a man and they will give them a shock a man and they will give them a shock a man and they will give them a shock and then reward them when they see and then reward them when they see and then reward them when they see a magazine with a woman a magazine with a woman a magazine with a woman and it don't work of course it cannot and it don't work of course it cannot and it don't work of course it cannot work if this is against work if this is against work if this is against what your genes are telling you who you what your genes are telling you who you what your genes are telling you who you are and what you need to do are and what you need to do are and what you need to do so um it becomes a very very big problem so um it becomes a very very big problem so um it becomes a very very big problem with dog training because often dog trainers want to show off often dog trainers want to show off how good they are so if something is not how good they are so if something is not how good they are so if something is not working working working they just start to press more and demand they just start to press more and demand they just start to press more and demand more more more i never really recognize and never i never really recognize and never i never really recognize and never really even looking for really even looking for really even looking for what is possible and what is not what is possible and what is not what is possible and what is not possible possible possible um of course you can change you can um of course you can change you can um of course you can change you can suppress things suppress things suppress things but the moment you allow it but the moment you allow it but the moment you allow it some freedom it go it will go to a home some freedom it go it will go to a home some freedom it go it will go to a home base base base and whatever the home base is you you

31:37

and whatever the home base is you you and whatever the home base is you you better know what it is better know what it is better know what it is and the best thing that you can do as a and the best thing that you can do as a and the best thing that you can do as a doctriner is to learn how to doctriner is to learn how to doctriner is to learn how to guide it instead of try to flip it guide it instead of try to flip it guide it instead of try to flip it around and change it to something else when um you know i i just realized when um you know i i just realized more and more the the power of genetics more and more the the power of genetics more and more the the power of genetics um there was you know um there was you know um there was you know like in in the 60s already the whole like in in the 60s already the whole like in in the 60s already the whole schenerian behaviorism started to break schenerian behaviorism started to break schenerian behaviorism started to break down like big down like big down like big time there were so many cool cool time there were so many cool cool time there were so many cool cool studies that came up studies that came up studies that came up and to show and to show and to show basically that that's not true that basically that that's not true that basically that that's not true that there is there is there is you know you cannot change everything you know you cannot change everything you know you cannot change everything through reinforcement and punishment through reinforcement and punishment through reinforcement and punishment and also the instincts of the dogs i and also the instincts of the dogs i and also the instincts of the dogs i mean it used to be that they didn't even mean it used to be that they didn't even mean it used to be that they didn't even believe that there is believe that there is believe that there is instinct instincts then of course there instinct instincts then of course there instinct instincts then of course there is the ethology and the behaviorism is the ethology and the behaviorism is the ethology and the behaviorism but eventually what really became very but eventually what really became very but eventually what really became very powerful was the evolutionary psychology powerful was the evolutionary psychology powerful was the evolutionary psychology which kind of really starts to explain which kind of really starts to explain which kind of really starts to explain why we do those things like for example why we do those things like for example why we do those things like for example you know if you you know if you

32:53

you know if you start walking on the grass and all of a start walking on the grass and all of a start walking on the grass and all of a sudden you jump sudden you jump sudden you jump away and you probably just saw a stick away and you probably just saw a stick away and you probably just saw a stick or a hose but that or a hose but that or a hose but that evolution of your success of survival evolution of your success of survival evolution of your success of survival has programmed that very deeply knew has programmed that very deeply knew has programmed that very deeply knew that that that this will be a snake and you will have this will be a snake and you will have this will be a snake and you will have to to to jump out and um jump out and um jump out and um when you when you when you yeah genetics are so so interesting i yeah genetics are so so interesting i yeah genetics are so so interesting i can really talk for for can really talk for for can really talk for for days and days about it um days and days about it um days and days about it um there is something you know even there is something you know even there is something you know even even people think courage or bravery even people think courage or bravery even people think courage or bravery everything is really genetic like you everything is really genetic like you everything is really genetic like you you actually have you actually have you actually have a genetic predisposition to be this kind a genetic predisposition to be this kind a genetic predisposition to be this kind of of of person or a dog that when situation person or a dog that when situation person or a dog that when situation comes it's not that you are not afraid comes it's not that you are not afraid comes it's not that you are not afraid it's not that you're whatever but you're it's not that you're whatever but you're it's not that you're whatever but you're ready to put it all in and ready to put it all in and ready to put it all in and okay today i'm gonna die that's fine but okay today i'm gonna die that's fine but okay today i'm gonna die that's fine but i'm i'm i'm in and that's that's another genetic in and that's that's another genetic in and that's that's another genetic thing thing thing and so it's the other one oh i'm gonna and so it's the other one oh i'm gonna and so it's the other one oh i'm gonna just just just stay away i am as a puppy a little bit stay away i am as a puppy a little bit stay away i am as a puppy a little bit shy a little bit shy a little bit shy a little bit i'm sure and those puppies suffer a lot i'm sure and those puppies suffer a lot

34:16

i'm sure and those puppies suffer a lot and those and those and those dogs also suffer a lot and mostly from dogs also suffer a lot and mostly from dogs also suffer a lot and mostly from dog trainers that don't understand dog trainers that don't understand dog trainers that don't understand genetics because they are convinced genetics because they are convinced genetics because they are convinced that there is some magic that they will that there is some magic that they will that there is some magic that they will do and that dog all of a sudden is going do and that dog all of a sudden is going do and that dog all of a sudden is going to be to be to be the confident dog like the other one the confident dog like the other one the confident dog like the other one and it just sends a sad for the dog and it just sends a sad for the dog and it just sends a sad for the dog that um this is not recognized then that um this is not recognized then that um this is not recognized then and providing the and providing the and providing the the environment that that dog's gonna the environment that that dog's gonna the environment that that dog's gonna strive and flourish with and instead we strive and flourish with and instead we strive and flourish with and instead we are trying to fix something that's not are trying to fix something that's not are trying to fix something that's not fixable and just fixable and just fixable and just tormenting the dogs like that tormenting the dogs like that tormenting the dogs like that um and that happens all the time if it's um and that happens all the time if it's um and that happens all the time if it's a a a such a bad idea um so genetics really so genetics really like um there was um there is a very like um there was um there is a very like um there was um there is a very cool book cool book cool book and again like i mean we i don't know i and again like i mean we i don't know i and again like i mean we i don't know i think at least think at least think at least i have three more jobs in my school that i have three more jobs in my school that i have three more jobs in my school that i i i talk about this but there is a book that talk about this but there is a book that talk about this but there is a book that i highly recommend anybody that's i highly recommend anybody that's i highly recommend anybody that's interested in genetics interested in genetics interested in genetics um i mean there's few books but let's um i mean there's few books but let's um i mean there's few books but let's just say just say just say one uh it's a robot plumbing one uh it's a robot plumbing

35:35

one uh it's a robot plumbing and the book name is uh blueprint and the book name is uh blueprint and the book name is uh blueprint and there is always the debate about and there is always the debate about and there is always the debate about nurture versus nature right environment nurture versus nature right environment nurture versus nature right environment versus genetics versus genetics versus genetics which one will which one is more which one will which one is more which one will which one is more important important important and which one can influence the other and which one can influence the other and which one can influence the other and of course they and of course they and of course they interact with each other so the way interact with each other so the way interact with each other so the way genetics work is genetics work is genetics work is uh let's say um let's let's say you go let's say um let's let's say you go you you're not really a gardener but you you you're not really a gardener but you you you're not really a gardener but you take a shovel and you start doing some take a shovel and you start doing some take a shovel and you start doing some things things things and pretty soon you get callouses and pretty soon you get callouses and pretty soon you get callouses and those calluses there you know and those calluses there you know and those calluses there you know they're genetically they're genetically they're genetically ready to come out at the right time ready to come out at the right time ready to come out at the right time but if you avoid certain things then but if you avoid certain things then but if you avoid certain things then they don't they don't they don't need to come out right but that doesn't need to come out right but that doesn't need to come out right but that doesn't mean that you're mean that you're mean that you're really uh changing genetics really uh changing genetics really uh changing genetics there's just no need for them right now there's just no need for them right now there's just no need for them right now but they're there at any moment but they're there at any moment but they're there at any moment so um plumbing did a really really cool so um plumbing did a really really cool so um plumbing did a really really cool studies um almost kind of what i studies um almost kind of what i studies um almost kind of what i think stumbled upon some accident of think stumbled upon some accident of think stumbled upon some accident of in the world war war in in england there in the world war war in in england there in the world war war in in england there was a was a

37:00

was a you know a lot of adoptions mothers were you know a lot of adoptions mothers were you know a lot of adoptions mothers were just dropping their just dropping their just dropping their babysit orphanages because it's a war babysit orphanages because it's a war babysit orphanages because it's a war and twins and twins and twins identical twins and the difference identical twins and the difference identical twins and the difference between identical twins and between identical twins and between identical twins and the normal twins is that they are the normal twins is that they are the normal twins is that they are actually like when you think of cloned actually like when you think of cloned actually like when you think of cloned animal or a person the animal or a person the animal or a person the uh identical twins are basically clone uh identical twins are basically clone uh identical twins are basically clone you know they're you know they're you know they're that's why they're called identical is that's why they're called identical is that's why they're called identical is that the x splits into that the x splits into that the x splits into and so that means that they are really and so that means that they are really and so that means that they are really super interesting material for super interesting material for super interesting material for observation and study for observation and study for observation and study for for this kind of study for this kind of study for this kind of study um the the one kid gets adopted by some um the the one kid gets adopted by some um the the one kid gets adopted by some middle class family the other one goes middle class family the other one goes middle class family the other one goes to a super rich to a super rich to a super rich well-off family nobody knows where the well-off family nobody knows where the well-off family nobody knows where the other one other one other one no no connection nothing and it just so no no connection nothing and it just so no no connection nothing and it just so happens that one day they meet at the university they just walk at meet at the university they just walk at each other in a hallway each other in a hallway each other in a hallway and they know it's just like you don't and they know it's just like you don't and they know it's just like you don't need to say nothing it's like need to say nothing it's like need to say nothing it's like you know and then they start talking to you know and then they start talking to you know and then they start talking to each other and each other and

38:14

each other and of course the events of the day like the of course the events of the day like the of course the events of the day like the same similar music same similar music same similar music the same food the same interest in the same food the same interest in the same food the same interest in science even their wives have the same science even their wives have the same science even their wives have the same features features features like like it's just amazing what starts like like it's just amazing what starts like like it's just amazing what starts to come out to come out to come out and besides that sensation of all this and besides that sensation of all this and besides that sensation of all this is so cool is so cool is so cool then they start to really evaluate it's then they start to really evaluate it's then they start to really evaluate it's like okay well how come like okay well how come like okay well how come he grew up in a completely different he grew up in a completely different he grew up in a completely different environment than him but ultimately environment than him but ultimately environment than him but ultimately they're right here they're right here they're right here and depending on the day when you and depending on the day when you and depending on the day when you measure one is a little bit more measure one is a little bit more measure one is a little bit more excitable or more irritated but then on excitable or more irritated but then on excitable or more irritated but then on another day another day another day you know but they're they're basically you know but they're they're basically you know but they're they're basically identical identical identical and so next thing you know there was and so next thing you know there was and so next thing you know there was they are showing them on tv and they are showing them on tv and they are showing them on tv and there is a third one and that's very there is a third one and that's very there is a third one and that's very uncommon to have uncommon to have uncommon to have three identical twins super uncommon but three identical twins super uncommon but three identical twins super uncommon but he sees them on tv and he knows he sees them on tv and he knows he sees them on tv and he knows like there is nothing to you know like there is nothing to you know like there is nothing to you know there's absolutely nothing to there's absolutely nothing to there's absolutely nothing to say he just packs and goes and drives to say he just packs and goes and drives to say he just packs and goes and drives to the university the university

39:23

the university and um there is a movie actually there and um there is a movie actually there and um there is a movie actually there is a movie i i can't remember what was is a movie i i can't remember what was is a movie i i can't remember what was the movie called but the movie called but the movie called but anybody that's interested in genetics anybody that's interested in genetics anybody that's interested in genetics and stuff that's twins studies are super and stuff that's twins studies are super and stuff that's twins studies are super cool and they they prove they just cool and they they prove they just cool and they they prove they just flip everything around and no matter how flip everything around and no matter how flip everything around and no matter how you like it or you don't you like it or you don't you like it or you don't like it you have to accept it because like it you have to accept it because like it you have to accept it because uh uh what uh uh what uh uh what what plumbing says it's very cool uh what plumbing says it's very cool uh what plumbing says it's very cool uh especially with especially with especially with how dog trainers believe that okay i'm how dog trainers believe that okay i'm how dog trainers believe that okay i'm gonna get the little puppy gonna get the little puppy gonna get the little puppy and i'm gonna make him whatever i want and i'm gonna make him whatever i want and i'm gonna make him whatever i want it does not work that way it does not work that way it does not work that way no matter what you try there is a no matter what you try there is a no matter what you try there is a genetic makeup that has genetic makeup that has genetic makeup that has limitations and he has direction just limitations and he has direction just limitations and he has direction just like a like a like a a kid that the mom says no you're gonna a kid that the mom says no you're gonna a kid that the mom says no you're gonna play piano and play piano and play piano and and that's you're gonna be really good and that's you're gonna be really good and that's you're gonna be really good at it or you're gonna play tennis or at it or you're gonna play tennis or at it or you're gonna play tennis or whatever the whatever the whatever the idea is you know um idea is you know um idea is you know um the interest is the interesting thing the interest is the interesting thing the interest is the interesting thing about genetics is even in those cases about genetics is even in those cases about genetics is even in those cases when the mom wants to teach when the mom wants to teach

40:34

when the mom wants to teach the kid to play something or be good at the kid to play something or be good at the kid to play something or be good at something something something and eventually get to school and then and eventually get to school and then and eventually get to school and then eventually get the money and so on eventually get the money and so on eventually get the money and so on it's that you know if it's a boy it's it's that you know if it's a boy it's it's that you know if it's a boy it's gonna end up attracting females gonna end up attracting females gonna end up attracting females and it's gonna be able to reproduce and and it's gonna be able to reproduce and and it's gonna be able to reproduce and reproduction reproduction reproduction and you know it's it's a very important and you know it's it's a very important and you know it's it's a very important things for the genes things for the genes things for the genes so even though you don't know but that's so even though you don't know but that's so even though you don't know but that's ultimately evolutionary ultimately evolutionary ultimately evolutionary psychology that's telling this not to go psychology that's telling this not to go psychology that's telling this not to go too far off on this too far off on this too far off on this one what plumbing says is very cool that one what plumbing says is very cool that one what plumbing says is very cool that he says parents are in he says parents are in he says parents are in uh parents how how was it parents are important but they don't parents are important but they don't matter matter matter it's a very tricky thing and it's very it's a very tricky thing and it's very it's a very tricky thing and it's very very hard to accept very hard to accept very hard to accept and what it means is it's not that you and what it means is it's not that you and what it means is it's not that you can live without your parents of course can live without your parents of course can live without your parents of course having parents and having nice family having parents and having nice family having parents and having nice family that's taking care that's taking care that's taking care of you and doing things it's of you and doing things it's of you and doing things it's great but they don't matter great but they don't matter great but they don't matter in terms of the your genetic in terms of the your genetic in terms of the your genetic predisposition predisposition predisposition like like kids that's gonna you know like like kids that's gonna you know

41:48

like like kids that's gonna you know somebody's gonna start to somebody's gonna start to somebody's gonna start to go through the school system and they go through the school system and they go through the school system and they parents gonna parents gonna parents gonna help them with the homework and get all help them with the homework and get all help them with the homework and get all ace a space and ace a space and ace a space and move on to the high school and move on to the high school and move on to the high school and eventually work its way college still eventually work its way college still eventually work its way college still okay and then eventually okay and then eventually okay and then eventually they're paying a ton of money and the they're paying a ton of money and the they're paying a ton of money and the kid is in the university kid is in the university kid is in the university and now they either have to somehow and now they either have to somehow and now they either have to somehow continue to help or continue to help or continue to help or there will be a very hard check it's there will be a very hard check it's there will be a very hard check it's like no you really are like no you really are like no you really are cannot be just because you want cannot be just because you want cannot be just because you want um and and it's the same with dogs it's um and and it's the same with dogs it's um and and it's the same with dogs it's the same with puppies the same with puppies the same with puppies there's so many cool studies and there's so many cool studies and there's so many cool studies and especially after this especially after this especially after this one that i was telling you um one that i was telling you um one that i was telling you um plumbing they there i think plumbing they there i think plumbing they there i think it's in millions it's in millions it's in millions like since the 96 or something they've like since the 96 or something they've like since the 96 or something they've done done done this up till right now just extensive this up till right now just extensive this up till right now just extensive studies on on studies on on studies on on twins and you you know like i don't know twins and you you know like i don't know twins and you you know like i don't know if you have if you have if you have siblings but anybody that does or siblings but anybody that does or siblings but anybody that does or anybody that has anybody that has anybody that has kids knows very well that they can grow kids knows very well that they can grow kids knows very well that they can grow up up

43:03

up they do grow up in the same environment they do grow up in the same environment they do grow up in the same environment they are taking care they are taking care they are taking care in the same way and they still have in the same way and they still have in the same way and they still have their own thoughts and their own their own thoughts and their own their own thoughts and their own interests unless there is that genetic interests unless there is that genetic interests unless there is that genetic makeup that makeup that makeup that you know the identical twins kind of you know the identical twins kind of you know the identical twins kind of thing thing thing um so these the genetics are you know um so these the genetics are you know um so these the genetics are you know super neglected and it goes all the way super neglected and it goes all the way super neglected and it goes all the way back to the behaviorism back to the behaviorism back to the behaviorism that we are taught that you know you can that we are taught that you know you can that we are taught that you know you can be anything you want to be be anything you want to be be anything you want to be now that doesn't mean that you don't try now that doesn't mean that you don't try now that doesn't mean that you don't try you know like if you if you want to be a you know like if you if you want to be a you know like if you if you want to be a world champion world champion world champion you have to say that you're going to be you have to say that you're going to be you have to say that you're going to be a world champion i guess a world champion i guess a world champion i guess because if you just are going and now because if you just are going and now because if you just are going and now i'm just training to test myself i'm just training to test myself i'm just training to test myself and to see where i am no and to see where i am no and to see where i am no nobody ever succeeds that way you know nobody ever succeeds that way you know nobody ever succeeds that way you know you're just putting yourself right there you're just putting yourself right there you're just putting yourself right there and that's where you are and that's where you are and that's where you are but it's also not good to but it's also not good to but it's also not good to fool yourself there is a lot of fool yourself there is a lot of fool yourself there is a lot of you know like uh from from experience i you know like uh from from experience i you know like uh from from experience i mean i train i travel mean i train i travel

44:14

mean i train i travel all the time and i teach so many people all the time and i teach so many people all the time and i teach so many people that are very successful and that are very successful and that are very successful and so many people that are not and so many people that are not and so many people that are not and my job is to look at the dog and look at my job is to look at the dog and look at my job is to look at the dog and look at the person and tell them if they have that if they have that predisposition to to be what they want predisposition to to be what they want predisposition to to be what they want to be to be to be because i've been there and i know what because i've been there and i know what because i've been there and i know what it takes and i know it takes and i know it takes and i know what it takes from the dog and what it what it takes from the dog and what it what it takes from the dog and what it takes for the personality takes for the personality takes for the personality you know like you you have to know how you know like you you have to know how you know like you you have to know how to deal with stress you have to to deal with stress you have to to deal with stress you have to you have to be super like yeah you have to be super like yeah you have to be super like yeah it's a it's such a combination it's such it's a it's such a combination it's such it's a it's such a combination it's such a package a package a package but a lot of times people don't want to but a lot of times people don't want to but a lot of times people don't want to hear it hear it hear it um and what happens also is um and what happens also is um and what happens also is when somebody says that you cannot then when somebody says that you cannot then when somebody says that you cannot then next one tells you oh i can make it next one tells you oh i can make it next one tells you oh i can make it and of course it's uh this is a big and of course it's uh this is a big and of course it's uh this is a big problem problem problem in in the whole society not just in in the whole society not just in in the whole society not just doctrine of doctrine of doctrine of you know that there is money to be made you know that there is money to be made you know that there is money to be made and there is always and there is always and there is always both ways you know somebody that wants both ways you know somebody that wants both ways you know somebody that wants to and somebody that tells them that to and somebody that tells them that to and somebody that tells them that they can they can

45:23

they can and you know it goes on that way and you know it goes on that way and you know it goes on that way um i know people that are um i know people that are um i know people that are they have spent 20 years they have went they have spent 20 years they have went they have spent 20 years they have went through through through maybe 15 dogs and they're still where maybe 15 dogs and they're still where maybe 15 dogs and they're still where they are but they still have that idea they are but they still have that idea they are but they still have that idea that they're gonna that they're gonna that they're gonna something great is coming ahead of them something great is coming ahead of them something great is coming ahead of them but they're getting frustrated and then but they're getting frustrated and then but they're getting frustrated and then the dogs are suffering because of that the dogs are suffering because of that the dogs are suffering because of that and i think it's really important to to and i think it's really important to to and i think it's really important to to recognize where you are recognize where you are recognize where you are and who you really can be and i don't and who you really can be and i don't and who you really can be and i don't think it's think it's think it's hard but you gotta hard but you gotta hard but you gotta gotta kinda push out the noise around gotta kinda push out the noise around gotta kinda push out the noise around you you you because it's always very misleading because it's always very misleading because it's always very misleading deep inside you know who you are like deep inside you know who you are like deep inside you know who you are like you really know you really know you really know like if i know i like if i know i like if i know i know the interest in ice skating i mean know the interest in ice skating i mean know the interest in ice skating i mean i like ice skating as i like ice skating as i like ice skating as but i wouldn't do figure skating it's but i wouldn't do figure skating it's but i wouldn't do figure skating it's just no interest for me but i know just no interest for me but i know just no interest for me but i know kids that would love to do it i would kids that would love to do it i would kids that would love to do it i would like to fight like to fight like to fight or you know so another thing with or you know so another thing with or you know so another thing with genetics genetics genetics real quick um you can some fighting sport let's say boxing or some fighting sport let's say boxing or ufc or whatever and there is a champion

46:52

ufc or whatever and there is a champion ufc or whatever and there is a champion and he's been champion for and he's been champion for and he's been champion for quite some time quite some time quite some time but he starts to realize that there is but he starts to realize that there is but he starts to realize that there is there are better competitors than him there are better competitors than him there are better competitors than him and the moment that comes and the moment that comes and the moment that comes in your head you know that you're not in your head you know that you're not in your head you know that you're not gonna be able to win because gonna be able to win because gonna be able to win because you're starting to fight or compete you're starting to fight or compete you're starting to fight or compete against against against somebody that has nothing to lose and somebody that has nothing to lose and somebody that has nothing to lose and has has has a very strong will and believe in a very strong will and believe in a very strong will and believe in himself that they are himself that they are himself that they are like let's say they're in the rankings like let's say they're in the rankings like let's say they're in the rankings tenth tenth tenth or something like that they're like no or something like that they're like no or something like that they're like no i'm really good i i'm really good i i'm really good i i can definitely get up there to where i can definitely get up there to where i can definitely get up there to where the one that it's already on the top the one that it's already on the top the one that it's already on the top and it's starts to feel that there is and it's starts to feel that there is and it's starts to feel that there is better than him then they start to avoid better than him then they start to avoid better than him then they start to avoid the competitions the competitions the competitions then there is all the excuses and then there is all the excuses and then there is all the excuses and and ultimately that's kind of how it and ultimately that's kind of how it and ultimately that's kind of how it gets changed gets changed gets changed um but when you um but when you um but when you have the the where i'm going with that have the the where i'm going with that have the the where i'm going with that story is that story is that story is that some something very interesting can some something very interesting can some something very interesting can happen to to a kid or a dog happen to to a kid or a dog happen to to a kid or a dog like when when we talk genetics so in a

48:05

like when when we talk genetics so in a like when when we talk genetics so in a kit example kit example kit example it's like we can pump and pump the kid it's like we can pump and pump the kid it's like we can pump and pump the kid up up up and we can tell him hey you really you and we can tell him hey you really you and we can tell him hey you really you can be the best tennis player in the can be the best tennis player in the can be the best tennis player in the world right now world right now world right now we just need to keep going strong every we just need to keep going strong every we just need to keep going strong every other day other day other day and we hire this trainer for that and and we hire this trainer for that and and we hire this trainer for that and that and that and what really happens again and what really happens again it's it's an innate as a person it's it's an innate as a person it's it's an innate as a person or as a dog you know what you can and or as a dog you know what you can and or as a dog you know what you can and what you cannot do what you cannot do what you cannot do but when they push you in that but when they push you in that but when they push you in that place that you have to place that you have to place that you have to perform and meet that perform and meet that perform and meet that um expectations that's been built up um expectations that's been built up um expectations that's been built up and you know you cannot meet it what and you know you cannot meet it what and you know you cannot meet it what happens is actually quite the opposite happens is actually quite the opposite happens is actually quite the opposite you shut down you shut down you shut down you start to go back and you start to you start to go back and you start to you start to go back and you start to look at excuses why look at excuses why look at excuses why you not gonna do it today or next month you not gonna do it today or next month you not gonna do it today or next month or next year or next year or next year so instead of you know parents and so instead of you know parents and so instead of you know parents and trainers think that they they really trainers think that they they really trainers think that they they really really want to build up something really want to build up something really want to build up something it actually goes the other way around to it actually goes the other way around to it actually goes the other way around to give you an example with dogs and let's give you an example with dogs and let's

49:16

give you an example with dogs and let's let's take protection training for let's take protection training for let's take protection training for example any protection sports example any protection sports example any protection sports so if the puppy or the dog is afraid or so if the puppy or the dog is afraid or so if the puppy or the dog is afraid or has some has some has some reservation some awareness of a stick reservation some awareness of a stick reservation some awareness of a stick yet yet yet so that that's i don't know if i can so that that's i don't know if i can so that that's i don't know if i can handle that so as a trainer you you have an option so as a trainer you you have an option to say to say to say i'm gonna go through this whole program i'm gonna go through this whole program i'm gonna go through this whole program and i'm gonna convince you that and i'm gonna convince you that and i'm gonna convince you that it's not gonna hurt and i'm gonna touch it's not gonna hurt and i'm gonna touch it's not gonna hurt and i'm gonna touch you and we're gonna play and we're gonna you and we're gonna play and we're gonna you and we're gonna play and we're gonna spend so much time and we're gonna spend so much time and we're gonna spend so much time and we're gonna counter condition and all these names counter condition and all these names counter condition and all these names and procedures we're gonna use on you and procedures we're gonna use on you and procedures we're gonna use on you and sure eventually you're gonna and sure eventually you're gonna and sure eventually you're gonna convince the puppy or the dog that convince the puppy or the dog that convince the puppy or the dog that that's not gonna hurt until the day that's not gonna hurt until the day that's not gonna hurt until the day comes that actually he gets stopped and comes that actually he gets stopped and comes that actually he gets stopped and it hurts it hurts it hurts and now he's not prepared and everything and now he's not prepared and everything and now he's not prepared and everything just crumbles in an instant just crumbles in an instant just crumbles in an instant all this hard work and all this all this hard work and all this all this hard work and all this magic it just goes out just like that magic it just goes out just like that magic it just goes out just like that because the approach is wrong because the approach is wrong because the approach is wrong so the only approach to to be successful so the only approach to to be successful so the only approach to to be successful is to see how far those genetics can

50:26

is to see how far those genetics can is to see how far those genetics can pull through instead of trying to pull through instead of trying to pull through instead of trying to fool the dog or the kid that this not fool the dog or the kid that this not fool the dog or the kid that this not gonna hurt or this whatever gonna hurt or this whatever gonna hurt or this whatever no it can hurt but maybe you can no it can hurt but maybe you can no it can hurt but maybe you can overcome it maybe that's how you will go overcome it maybe that's how you will go overcome it maybe that's how you will go through and so training um through and so training um through and so training um as i said there is like almost two as i said there is like almost two as i said there is like almost two really distinctive really distinctive really distinctive different parts of approaches to different parts of approaches to different parts of approaches to training and training and training and most trainers are very busy to teach most trainers are very busy to teach most trainers are very busy to teach behaviors behaviors behaviors completely disregard emotions completely disregard emotions completely disregard emotions and emotions are super critical because and emotions are super critical because and emotions are super critical because without emotion how you feel about without emotion how you feel about without emotion how you feel about doing something do you like to do it or doing something do you like to do it or doing something do you like to do it or do you not like to do it do you not like to do it do you not like to do it do you feel comfort confident that do you feel comfort confident that do you feel comfort confident that you're good at it or you feel that you're good at it or you feel that you're good at it or you feel that you're forced to do you're forced to do you're forced to do emotions is probably the more important emotions is probably the more important emotions is probably the more important thing than the actual behavior but thing than the actual behavior but thing than the actual behavior but as a typical trainer everybody is preoccupied being with a everybody is preoccupied being with a clicker being with the clicker being with the clicker being with the electric working level color but it's electric working level color but it's electric working level color but it's all about all about all about behaviors it's a sit come back go to a behaviors it's a sit come back go to a behaviors it's a sit come back go to a place whatever how the dog feels what is the motivation

51:41

how the dog feels what is the motivation it's almost so secondary that it's almost so secondary that it's almost so secondary that and eventually it just surfaces there is no way that it it just surfaces there is no way that it wouldn't wouldn't wouldn't and and then it becomes apparent how and and then it becomes apparent how and and then it becomes apparent how important it is and some trainers may important it is and some trainers may important it is and some trainers may come out of it and change and some come out of it and change and some come out of it and change and some just do more of what they normally do just do more of what they normally do just do more of what they normally do but that's that's genetics i can really but that's that's genetics i can really but that's that's genetics i can really talk so much about it talk so much about it talk so much about it so it's interesting before you went into so it's interesting before you went into so it's interesting before you went into the the specific stories like the um the the the specific stories like the um the the the specific stories like the um the twins twins twins or the triplets um i i would think or the triplets um i i would think or the triplets um i i would think you know you going to different you know you going to different you know you going to different countries and working with people countries and working with people countries and working with people that um you don't speak the same that um you don't speak the same that um you don't speak the same language that that would kind of give language that that would kind of give language that that would kind of give you you you um uh a way to um uh a way to um uh a way to communicate with someone or an animal communicate with someone or an animal communicate with someone or an animal uh like on an on an emotional level like uh like on an on an emotional level like uh like on an on an emotional level like you don't have to you don't have to you don't have to actually hear them talking you can kind actually hear them talking you can kind actually hear them talking you can kind of see them of see them of see them like a movie body language yeah that's a like a movie body language yeah that's a like a movie body language yeah that's a very good point very good point very good point that actually i will add feeling a that actually i will add feeling a that actually i will add feeling a little more to this because uh little more to this because uh little more to this because uh again something like um again something like um again something like um i i'm super super big on play

52:58

i i'm super super big on play i i'm super super big on play like i place like i place like i place the most important thing as far as i'm the most important thing as far as i'm the most important thing as far as i'm concerned concerned concerned as an interaction with dogs um as an interaction with dogs um as an interaction with dogs um there is trainers that there is trainers that there is trainers that especially like agility trainers still especially like agility trainers still especially like agility trainers still will fill up will fill up will fill up a toy with treats to teach the dog to a toy with treats to teach the dog to a toy with treats to teach the dog to play play play which is completely mind-blowing i mean which is completely mind-blowing i mean which is completely mind-blowing i mean it's ridiculous it's ridiculous it's ridiculous um there is the marine sea world um there is the marine sea world um there is the marine sea world type of trainers um they also type of trainers um they also type of trainers um they also they there's a whole wave of trainers they there's a whole wave of trainers they there's a whole wave of trainers that believe that play is something that that believe that play is something that that believe that play is something that you you you teach something that becomes you know teach something that becomes you know teach something that becomes you know reinforced reinforced reinforced with a primary reinforcement and with a primary reinforcement and with a primary reinforcement and therefore starts the dog starts to like therefore starts the dog starts to like therefore starts the dog starts to like and play is a super important and play is a super important and play is a super important biological need like we just like we biological need like we just like we biological need like we just like we come come come ready and you know primary reinforcers ready and you know primary reinforcers ready and you know primary reinforcers food food food sex um sleep all this sex um sleep all this sex um sleep all this um avoid discomfort um avoid discomfort um avoid discomfort plays the same thing it's a it's an plays the same thing it's a it's an plays the same thing it's a it's an innate innate innate biological programming that biological programming that biological programming that that we come with especially mammals and that we come with especially mammals and that we come with especially mammals and all mammals come with that very few humans dogs very few humans dogs for sure never it never gets old it's for sure never it never gets old it's

54:26

for sure never it never gets old it's not like you can see a cow not like you can see a cow not like you can see a cow playing ball you can see like if you go playing ball you can see like if you go playing ball you can see like if you go on youtube you can see on youtube you can see on youtube you can see uh a dolphin on the open completely uh a dolphin on the open completely uh a dolphin on the open completely random dolphin random dolphin random dolphin and some rugby players from australia and some rugby players from australia and some rugby players from australia tossing tossing tossing a rugby ball and the dolphin is doing a rugby ball and the dolphin is doing a rugby ball and the dolphin is doing fetch without no fetch without no fetch without no i mean obviously a wild animal you know i mean obviously a wild animal you know i mean obviously a wild animal you know so so so we all mammals specifically are really we all mammals specifically are really we all mammals specifically are really really really really ready to play as youngsters but as they ready to play as youngsters but as they ready to play as youngsters but as they grow up it kind of goes away grow up it kind of goes away grow up it kind of goes away but play if you deprive a kid from play but play if you deprive a kid from play but play if you deprive a kid from play you will you will not develop correctly you will you will not develop correctly you will you will not develop correctly if you uh um if you uh um if you uh um dogs people we we can play dogs people we we can play dogs people we we can play and we can come up with endless like and we can come up with endless like and we can come up with endless like there is an infinite there is an infinite there is an infinite number of games that you can come up number of games that you can come up number of games that you can come up with you will never be able to with you will never be able to with you will never be able to say okay i cannot come up with another say okay i cannot come up with another say okay i cannot come up with another game there is always gonna be game there is always gonna be game there is always gonna be like a game that you can come up with like a game that you can come up with like a game that you can come up with and that's to tell you how and that's to tell you how and that's to tell you how prepared you are to play prepared you are to play prepared you are to play what play does it teaches cooperation what play does it teaches cooperation what play does it teaches cooperation trust i mean when we're talking about trust i mean when we're talking about

55:34

trust i mean when we're talking about building relationship and engagement and building relationship and engagement and building relationship and engagement and all these things that trainers all these things that trainers all these things that trainers you know cliche words with you know cliche words with you know cliche words with how we do with the food when you play how we do with the food when you play how we do with the food when you play you actually build on this and you don't you actually build on this and you don't you actually build on this and you don't need need need language you can like if a kid is good language you can like if a kid is good language you can like if a kid is good at playing soccer and he has a confidence that it's good and he has a confidence that it's good it's not uh made up from his parents it's not uh made up from his parents it's not uh made up from his parents telling him he actually telling him he actually telling him he actually knows he is good you can you can take knows he is good you can you can take knows he is good you can you can take any american kid and throw him in the any american kid and throw him in the any american kid and throw him in the favelas in brazil favelas in brazil favelas in brazil and he would know nobody and it would be and he would know nobody and it would be and he would know nobody and it would be the scariest neighborhood the scariest neighborhood the scariest neighborhood ever and within five minutes ever and within five minutes ever and within five minutes he will be playing with the kids soccer he will be playing with the kids soccer he will be playing with the kids soccer that's how powerful games are and and that's how powerful games are and and that's how powerful games are and and kind of kind of kind of that's why i interrupted you because that's why i interrupted you because that's why i interrupted you because my passion and love for dogs was my passion and love for dogs was my passion and love for dogs was recognized recognized recognized by other people elsewhere in the world by other people elsewhere in the world by other people elsewhere in the world immediately and the connections and immediately and the connections and immediately and the connections and interactions were just interactions were just interactions were just they just kept rolling because of that they just kept rolling because of that they just kept rolling because of that so it's a very similar so it's a very similar so it's a very similar thing i i actually uh i i actually uh got your i think it was the for the got your i think it was the for the

56:52

got your i think it was the for the first video i watched of yours was the first video i watched of yours was the first video i watched of yours was the focused healing video focused healing video focused healing video and um that completely changed the way and um that completely changed the way and um that completely changed the way that i interact with rika with my that i interact with rika with my that i interact with rika with my belgian malinois who's a year old belgian malinois who's a year old belgian malinois who's a year old um really making everything a game and um really making everything a game and um really making everything a game and it's made just the whole training it's made just the whole training it's made just the whole training experience experience experience so much better like more fun so much better like more fun so much better like more fun more uh exciting and it's not so more uh exciting and it's not so more uh exciting and it's not so um like i feel like i'm using my um like i feel like i'm using my um like i feel like i'm using my imagination more imagination more imagination more yeah for you for sure are and that's yeah for you for sure are and that's yeah for you for sure are and that's exactly there is like exactly there is like exactly there is like a door opens up to where a door opens up to where a door opens up to where the interaction goes both ways and it's the interaction goes both ways and it's the interaction goes both ways and it's perfectly perfectly perfectly understood but both of you and the understood but both of you and the understood but both of you and the intentions and the emotions to where intentions and the emotions to where intentions and the emotions to where there is no way you can accomplish there is no way you can accomplish there is no way you can accomplish something like this in in any other way something like this in in any other way something like this in in any other way yeah oh um i want to also yeah oh um i want to also yeah oh um i want to also ask you where do you see the future of ask you where do you see the future of ask you where do you see the future of dog training going yeah so that's a that's a big one yeah so that's a that's a big one that's bigger than genetics um that's bigger than genetics um that's bigger than genetics um yeah i i try to yeah i i try to yeah i i try to stay optimistic i try to think that we can do we can train dogs in a better we can do we can train dogs in a better way way way we can treat them with respect and we can treat them with respect and we can treat them with respect and somehow unite somehow unite

58:38

somehow unite in in all different areas of like old in in all different areas of like old in in all different areas of like old dog lovers like dog lovers like dog lovers like you know and and protect each other from you know and and protect each other from you know and and protect each other from the the the animal rights and there's just animal rights and there's just animal rights and there's just people that really don't want us to have people that really don't want us to have people that really don't want us to have dogs and they are winning and they're dogs and they are winning and they're dogs and they are winning and they're winning because winning because winning because we're splitting and we're fighting these we're splitting and we're fighting these we're splitting and we're fighting these little fights like five people little fights like five people little fights like five people from this and five people from there from this and five people from there from this and five people from there it's like all new york it's like all new york it's like all new york not a good trainer because you're not a good trainer because you're not a good trainer because you're following this ideology and you're following this ideology and you're following this ideology and you're something and of course there is truths something and of course there is truths something and of course there is truths to that but uh to that but uh to that but uh there is a much bigger picture and we there is a much bigger picture and we there is a much bigger picture and we gotta gotta gotta we need to try to stay we need to try to stay we need to try to stay on track and and support each other on track and and support each other on track and and support each other and at the same time though i'm very and at the same time though i'm very and at the same time though i'm very much against much against much against um the um the um the there is always that approach there is always that approach there is always that approach of i'm gonna tell you that you're a of i'm gonna tell you that you're a of i'm gonna tell you that you're a great trainer and i expect that you tell great trainer and i expect that you tell great trainer and i expect that you tell me that i'm a great trainer me that i'm a great trainer me that i'm a great trainer and then you're gonna tell him that i'm and then you're gonna tell him that i'm and then you're gonna tell him that i'm not that great because i'm doing this not that great because i'm doing this not that great because i'm doing this and this but then we're gonna meet again and this but then we're gonna meet again

59:44

and this but then we're gonna meet again and we have and we have and we have so there is a lot of shady interactions so there is a lot of shady interactions so there is a lot of shady interactions between us between us between us and when when and when when and when when i i wish that when somebody sees bad i i wish that when somebody sees bad i i wish that when somebody sees bad training training training they call it and it doesn't matter who they call it and it doesn't matter who they call it and it doesn't matter who it is it is it is um if that doesn't happen um if that doesn't happen um if that doesn't happen i i don't see how we move forward and i i don't see how we move forward and i i don't see how we move forward and the reason the reason the reason like competitions are very cool when we like competitions are very cool when we like competitions are very cool when we have have have competitions they're kind of like um competitions they're kind of like um competitions they're kind of like um you know like science scientists they go you know like science scientists they go you know like science scientists they go to the lab and they do their experiments to the lab and they do their experiments to the lab and they do their experiments and they do their findings and they do their findings and they do their findings in dog training you have competitions in dog training you have competitions in dog training you have competitions and the and the and the the competition field is basically the the competition field is basically the the competition field is basically the lab and this is where lab and this is where lab and this is where you know you you talk the talk and then you know you you talk the talk and then you know you you talk the talk and then you walk the walk it's not on the you walk the walk it's not on the you walk the walk it's not on the keyboard and it's not how many followers keyboard and it's not how many followers keyboard and it's not how many followers you have and it's not you have and it's not you have and it's not um but it's a very interesting time with um but it's a very interesting time with um but it's a very interesting time with the social media because um the social media because um the social media because um it's very easy to to become famous it's very easy to to become famous it's very easy to to become famous without a base without a base without a base and then and then and then and then and then and then yeah you start to teach and you don't yeah you start to teach and you don't yeah you start to teach and you don't know know know and there is a it's a it's kind of

1:01:01

and there is a it's a it's kind of and there is a it's a it's kind of strange situation because uh strange situation because uh strange situation because uh there is not as astrophysic there is not as astrophysic there is not as astrophysic really smart guy uh neil degrasse tyson really smart guy uh neil degrasse tyson really smart guy uh neil degrasse tyson he has a super cool quote he has a super cool quote he has a super cool quote let me see if i can remember it right let me see if i can remember it right let me see if i can remember it right now um a great challenge in life a great challenge in life it's that you oh man it's that you oh man it's that you oh man i'm not go i'm gonna butcher it but it's i'm not go i'm gonna butcher it but it's i'm not go i'm gonna butcher it but it's basically you think that you know basically you think that you know basically you think that you know so you know a topic so you know a topic so you know a topic well enough but you just don't know that well enough but you just don't know that well enough but you just don't know that you don't know and if you stay in a bubble you always and if you stay in a bubble you always gonna gonna gonna think high of yourself and you will not think high of yourself and you will not think high of yourself and you will not dare to dare to dare to check yourself but unless you check check yourself but unless you check check yourself but unless you check yourself you have no yourself you have no yourself you have no progress you have no evolution as as a progress you have no evolution as as a progress you have no evolution as as a trainer trainer trainer then even even if you have so many then even even if you have so many then even even if you have so many followers and and followers and and followers and and make people believe and and you believe make people believe and and you believe make people believe and and you believe in yourself in yourself in yourself but you don't go and you check yourself but you don't go and you check yourself but you don't go and you check yourself and see where where where is my lane and see where where where is my lane and see where where where is my lane let's say there is let's say there is let's say there is 80 dogs that are going to compete and 80 dogs that are going to compete and 80 dogs that are going to compete and i'm gonna go and i'm gonna get ready i'm gonna go and i'm gonna get ready i'm gonna go and i'm gonna get ready and i will see if my dog and all the and i will see if my dog and all the and i will see if my dog and all the [ __ ] that i make up in my head [ __ ] that i make up in my head

1:02:27

[ __ ] that i make up in my head actually where it stands with everything actually where it stands with everything actually where it stands with everything a lot of people that's why they train a lot of people that's why they train a lot of people that's why they train and compete and compete and compete and a lot of people that's the reason and a lot of people that's the reason and a lot of people that's the reason why they avoid it why they avoid it why they avoid it um and we don't have like you know in in um and we don't have like you know in in um and we don't have like you know in in that that that industry like having certification is a industry like having certification is a industry like having certification is a very easy thing very easy thing very easy thing right i mean it's laughable you don't right i mean it's laughable you don't right i mean it's laughable you don't need certification you can start your need certification you can start your need certification you can start your dog business tomorrow dog business tomorrow dog business tomorrow like there's just so such simple steps like there's just so such simple steps like there's just so such simple steps you you make you you make you you make just two page website you put that just two page website you put that just two page website you put that google ad you make the social media google ad you make the social media google ad you make the social media and you get your first client tomorrow and you get your first client tomorrow and you get your first client tomorrow guaranteed guaranteed guaranteed but if you truly want to be somebody and but if you truly want to be somebody and but if you truly want to be somebody and you want to be you want to be you want to be good at what you do and get the good at what you do and get the good at what you do and get the satisfaction because there's a whole satisfaction because there's a whole satisfaction because there's a whole different level of satisfaction when you different level of satisfaction when you different level of satisfaction when you actually are good at something and actually are good at something and actually are good at something and you're teaching something you're teaching something you're teaching something that he has value that you you're really that he has value that you you're really that he has value that you you're really giving something back that giving something back that giving something back that makes people grow it's not bullshitting makes people grow it's not bullshitting makes people grow it's not bullshitting people people people it's really worth it but there is you

1:03:36

it's really worth it but there is you it's really worth it but there is you know like unless know like unless know like unless unless this happens we're stuck in this situation where we are right now um situation where we are right now um and ultimately yeah some people call it yeah some people call it electric steam some people call it shock electric steam some people call it shock electric steam some people call it shock collar collar collar then you have it's it's ridiculous how then you have it's it's ridiculous how then you have it's it's ridiculous how we talk about each other and we talk about each other and we talk about each other and what we do and what we believe but we what we do and what we believe but we what we do and what we believe but we never never never can check can check can check everybody would avoid that unless everybody would avoid that unless everybody would avoid that unless they they feel that they're good or they they feel that they're good or they they feel that they're good or they don't mind where they are they're they don't mind where they are they're they don't mind where they are they're fine with who they are and where they fine with who they are and where they fine with who they are and where they are are are um other than that there is gonna be um other than that there is gonna be um other than that there is gonna be you know i don't know if that answers you know i don't know if that answers you know i don't know if that answers the question really the question really the question really it's a it's a tough one this is a always it's a it's a tough one this is a always it's a it's a tough one this is a always a very difficult a very difficult a very difficult one to talk about um one to talk about um one to talk about um like i again i i have really nothing to like i again i i have really nothing to like i again i i have really nothing to prove nothing in prove nothing in prove nothing in in no area of anything that i've done in no area of anything that i've done in no area of anything that i've done anything that i have thought of that i anything that i have thought of that i anything that i have thought of that i want to accomplish want to accomplish want to accomplish i have accomplished and i have i have accomplished and i have i have accomplished and i have accomplished it accomplished it accomplished it a few times more um a few times more um a few times more um so like if i say well i don't need to so like if i say well i don't need to so like if i say well i don't need to compete right now compete right now compete right now why would i i mean i i've won

1:05:09

why would i i mean i i've won why would i i mean i i've won since like 2000 till today i have won since like 2000 till today i have won since like 2000 till today i have won 15 championships so that means that 15 championships so that means that 15 championships so that means that there is there is there is five maybe i didn't have a dog that was five maybe i didn't have a dog that was five maybe i didn't have a dog that was on transition whatever on transition whatever on transition whatever it was and then i had won a world it was and then i had won a world it was and then i had won a world championship and then i did it again championship and then i did it again championship and then i did it again and i can i can completely stop and just and i can i can completely stop and just and i can i can completely stop and just say i'm the greatest say i'm the greatest say i'm the greatest but what's the point like if you if you but what's the point like if you if you but what's the point like if you if you stop yourself like that then you don't stop yourself like that then you don't stop yourself like that then you don't progress then progress then progress then then the only if you're not going then the only if you're not going then the only if you're not going up you're going down right you're just up you're going down right you're just up you're going down right you're just gonna end up gonna end up gonna end up watching tv needing doritos and and watching tv needing doritos and and watching tv needing doritos and and eventually just kind of eventually just kind of eventually just kind of die a boring life but the reason i go and compete is but the reason i go and compete is because i because i because i always think of different ways always think of different ways always think of different ways how i can stimulate a dog how i can how i can stimulate a dog how i can how i can stimulate a dog how i can interact with a dog interact with a dog interact with a dog how would that what i'm trying to teach how would that what i'm trying to teach how would that what i'm trying to teach and work with and work with and work with how is it going to perform is it going how is it going to perform is it going how is it going to perform is it going to stand the pressure of to stand the pressure of to stand the pressure of all the other competitors and and being all the other competitors and and being all the other competitors and and being innovative and innovative and innovative and like this is what it's about you know like this is what it's about you know like this is what it's about you know so absolutely so absolutely

1:06:23

so absolutely i've been thank you so much for sharing i've been thank you so much for sharing i've been thank you so much for sharing everything that you've shared and also everything that you've shared and also everything that you've shared and also inspiring me inspiring me inspiring me and everyone that's watching and just and everyone that's watching and just and everyone that's watching and just the dog world in general you're welcome the dog world in general you're welcome the dog world in general you're welcome it was fun it was fun it was fun hopefully everybody that listens go hopefully everybody that listens go hopefully everybody that listens go after your dreams don't don't sit back after your dreams don't don't sit back after your dreams don't don't sit back challenge yourself challenge yourself challenge yourself it's okay to lose it's okay to fall down it's okay to lose it's okay to fall down it's okay to lose it's okay to fall down if you don't fall down if you don't fall down if you don't fall down you're not gonna get up and go forward you're not gonna get up and go forward you're not gonna get up and go forward you're just gonna you're just gonna you're just gonna stay as most of the people do so stay as most of the people do so stay as most of the people do so dream high i'm good example make it dream high i'm good example make it dream high i'm good example make it happen happen happen yes thank you thank you ivan yeah yes thank you thank you ivan yeah yes thank you thank you ivan yeah see you