E22: 에이미 존슨(Amy Johnson) - "한 번에 한 순간씩"

Um, and I cannot take any credit for that because we got him after he, his championship was finished from friends of ours who, uh, were involved in the breeding of, of him. So, uh, so he can look really pretty. Um, so that's his special skill. He just doesn't really enjoy looking pretty. So what, what gets posted online of him are funny things where he's got, you know, drool or his big lips are spread out on the floor when he's lying down or, um, you know, he, he just, he's, he's massive and he takes up huge amounts of space. And, and so the pictures that I take are the ones that are, are just try and show that and communicate that. I mean, it'd be joke that he's a house pony. Um, you know, he's not even really a dog. He's, he's horse size. So, um, and then Zora, it's funny because she's the small dog in the house and people look at us when we say we have a 60 pound dog that's considered the small dog and they, you know, okay. Um, but she's, she's, she's got a few more brain cells in there. Um, I, I do joke that, um, I have to have dogs in my house that are dumber than me. So to, to call Costner, not that smart is really in our house. It's not an insult. It's, uh, that's just my reality. I'm not, I can't, you know, I admire the people who have the border collies and the Jack Russell and the Shelties and all of those really, really smart dogs. That is not who I am and what I want to live with. Um, so, so we have just dogs that are really good dog citizens and, uh, they know the routines, you know, Costner knows that he has to sit before he gets his food. Um, sometimes he just stays sitting even after I put his food down. Um, but it's, you know, so we have our routines, but, um, basically we just, we just want our dogs to be good citizens and, and I think we've kind of got a good balance of that. So. Fair enough. So I mentioned in your bio that you got your start taking photos at confirmation events. Was that kind of where your interest in photography started? Where did kind of you get started just in photography in general? In general, I got started, um, back in junior high. My dad had a Minolta, uh, film camera, SLR camera, um, manual focus. Um, and he taught me the basics of photography, the basis, basics of exposure. So he taught me about shutter speed and aperture. And at that point it was called film speed. Now it's called ISO. Um, but he taught me the basics of, of the exposure triangle as it's called. Um, and how to, um, focus a manual focus camera and how to set my exposure, um, so that I expose the film properly. Um, I never did any dark room.

Um, it was always take the film, the 35 millimeter film canister to the, you know, the Walmart or wherever and, and get it developed. So I don't, I'm not quite that much of a purist. Um, but I do have my, my beginnings were definitely in film. Um, and with my dad and we would go, he, uh, we would vacation on the North shore of Lake Superior here in Minnesota. And, um, so he would take pictures and then, um, he would show me how to take pictures. And, uh, so kind of that, that mother daughter, that father daughter, um, bond, um, was really, um, enhanced by, by our experience with him teaching me how to use a camera and how to, how to take pictures. Um, so I kind of dabbled with it throughout the years as I was growing up. Um, I was given by my brother and my parents one year for my birthday, they gave me a film SLR of my own. And this was a little more advanced. It was a Canon EOS Elan 2, I think. Um, and it, and it had autofocus. So I didn't have to do the manual focus thing anymore. Um, which, you know, there's some real skill involved in, in manual focus. And I, I admire the photographers who can do it and do it well. It's not my thing. Um, but it's, there is, I understand the appeal of it. Um, it kind of forces you to slow down and really take things in. Um, but I, so I had a film SLR that, um, I just, again, just kind of kept dabbling, you know, in various things. Um, and then I got into dog shows and that's a whole long story that we could talk about some other time. But, um, I, I did, I was showing, um, my, uh, second great name. Her name was Mackenzie. I was showing her in confirmation. I was terrible, awful. I neither. She didn't have the temperament for it. I didn't have the skills for it. Um, we tried for about a year and didn't really get anywhere other than I made a lot of friends and really enjoyed learning about the confirmation world and, um, understanding even just the rhythm of a confirmation show and understanding, okay, these dogs are going in the ring and then they're coming out and then they're going back in. And then, so, you know, it's very confusing at first and then you kind of figure out, oh, okay, I know what's going on. I know why those dogs are going back in and those dogs aren't going back in. And, uh, yeah, so I learned a lot about dog shows and I learned a lot about the people who breed dogs. And that was fascinating to me. Um, I was taking a camera to most shows that I went to and just, um, taking pictures of my friends. And then one time, and this was actually with a digital camera, one of the very, very early

digital cameras that actually used the three and a quarter inch floppy drives, floppy disks disks. Um, so not even memory cards, these were, you know, the, the, not the five and a quarter, but the, I think they're three and a half inch, um, floppy disks. And that was your, your memory card. So, um, and that didn't respond very fast. So a dog moving across the ring, you know, you, you'd hit the shutter button and it would about two seconds later, it would actually take the picture. Well, there's no more dog left in the frame if it takes that long to take the picture. So one time I brought my film camera with me and really enjoyed the success I had with getting dogs moving in the ring rather than just the ones where they were stacked. So then my vet invited me to do, to photograph her club's agility trial. And that's where, that's where it really kind of took off for me. So, um, I really enjoyed the, the different games. I think it was a USDA trial, but I'm not a hundred percent sure. Um, but the different games where, you know, some were all jumps and some were, you didn't know where the dog was going to go, which I now know as gamblers. Um, and it was just, it was a really, and again, that camaraderie around the ring of all the people and their dogs was really intriguing to me and, and, um, just was very welcoming and fun. So, um, and there was a market for the photos there. There was really no market, um, back in 99, 2000 for candid photos, um, ringside at confirmation shows. Nobody was doing them. Nobody knew what those were, you know, but agility trials on the other hand, there was a market for that. People understood what that was. People liked pictures of their dog doing agility. So there was a market there for, for it being a business, not just a, you know, I'm going to show up and have fun. Um, so I did one agility trial with a film camera and then quickly realized that I would go broke, um, on film and processing and, um, and then, and digital cameras, digital SLRs were just coming out. So, uh, this was in 2000 and I, um, convinced my husband, my poor husband to let me buy a film or, uh, excuse me, a digital SLR, the Canon D30. Um, and as he's hitting submit order on B&H's website, he's, he's looking at me and saying, just promise me you'll try and make some money from this. Um, and the camera paid for itself in, I think, two shows. We, we kind of, we realized we had kind of a winning formula there. Um, and so I haven't, you know, never have even thought about going back to film, of course, and digital cameras have gotten amazingly good and amazingly, um, fast and responsive and,

and make my job easier with every new camera that I get. So can you share a little more about how you went kind of from that stage of your business to, to where you are now? Cause now you do really, really big shows and I mean, just kind of an interesting evolution. Right. Yeah. It started out as me and a camera and sometimes my husband would come. Um, I, my first national event was actually in 2001. And, you know, I look back on this and I, I really had no business doing it, but you know, I was invited again, the whole, uh, so the, the social aspect of it, I had made friends and they said, will you come? And I said, well, okay, sure. So 2001 NADAC championships and it was in Minnesota. It was in Mankato, which is about, I think five hours South of me. Um, so it wasn't like going out of state and I, you know, made a leap. Now, the only interesting, really interesting part of this was I had a five week old baby at that point. So I, it was me and a camera and Ben, my husband and Micah, our five week old baby who made the trek down to Mankato. And, um, I had told my friends who were in charge of the show, I had said, if this isn't working for me with having a baby here, we're going to just have to cut and run at some point. And they were like, that's fine. You know, you do what you need to do, but it all worked. Um, and, uh, we had an amazing time and, uh, I got an exposure to, um, what a national event was. And that was, you know, there's, there's a lot of adrenaline that comes with that. Um, 2007, I was invited to do AKC agility nationals. Um, so, you know, from 2001 to 2007, I was just mostly doing weekend stuff. Um, 07 was AKC nationals. And again, it was still just me and Ben. Um, Ben was in the booth, um, running the sales, uh, side of things. I was taking pictures. Um, gradually over the years, I've added, um, photographers and over the past two years, maybe two and a half. Um, I've really tried to, when I go to a national event, tried to make sure I had a photographer in every ring. Um, and then also increase the, the size of my booth staff so that if someone comes to the booth and wants to look at pictures, they don't have to wait to, to get some help to do that. Um, so it's, it's been just a gradual, the whole business has been a very gradual, well, let's try this now and let's add this now. And what, what if we do this or what if we change this? You know, I've never taken out huge loans for the business. It's always just kind of grown under its own as it can support more, you know, I'll, I'll put a little more money out.

And then, you know, it's just been a very gradual, um, making sure, you know, everything still feels comfortable or as comfortable as it can be when you're running your own business. You started to talk for a minute there just about like having a photographer on each ring and things like that. What, what's that process like? You, you mentioned, you know, having a booth and then having people shooting photos. I mean, how do you get from one to the other and like handle all of that in the midst of, you know, a big show going on? Um, a lot of deep breaths, um, uh, a lot of, a lot of screaming in my head that I don't let come out of my mouth. Um, no, it's, it's all good. It's, um, I think if I had tried to go from me and a camera and my husband to, you know, covering six rings and having six staff in the booth, you know, immediately, you know, as a sudden thing, I would have probably decided it was crazy and I was never going to do that again. But, um, you know, it went from, so one of the early AKC nationals that I did probably in 08 or 09, um, there was me that was, uh, there, great Jane photos was there plus another photography vendor was there. So we just very, you know, amicably divided up, okay, I'll take these rings on these days and you take those rings on those days. Um, and so there were, there were two actual, you know, there were two photographers there and each of us had, I think at least two photographers so we could cover all the rings, but it was between two different companies. And so over the year, um, yeah, so that's, you know, that's okay. I can, I can manage a few people in the booth and a few people out shooting for me. Um, and then it's just gradually shifted where the, um, AKC and, uh, you know, these different agility organizations have said, you know, Amy, if you can cover the whole thing, we're happy to allow you to do that. Um, and so, um, it's, if it was a sudden transition, I would have probably not managed it, but just gradually adding more and more. It's like anything, once you are comfortable at one, you know, in, in, at one level of, of, um, participation, you kind of go, oh, well, let's see, how, how else can I get involved or how, what more can I add on my plate? And, you know, at some point you may go, oh, that's too much. But, um, you know, adding photographers has been kind of just word of mouth and, um, you know, adding, you know, knowing people, uh, from other events or, um, one photographer who shot for me, I had seen his work from a previous national event and he, he was, he did a really nice job. And so I invited him to come and work for me.

Um, and that's actually happened a couple of times. Uh, one of my, uh, photographers is someone who, uh, approached me at a trial here in Minnesota, um, and said, you know, I'm really interested in this. Do you want to just take a peek at what I've done? Um, and, and she, uh, lived close enough to me that she could come to a lot of my different local shows and I could mentor her and, and, uh, well, okay, that shot didn't work so well. So what could we do differently? Or, you know, oh, that's a great one. Let's, you know, if you get a chance to do that kind of a shot again, go for it. Um, so just kind of, uh, that, I think that's the beginnings of, of the education piece. Um, you know, that, that I, I really enjoyed that mentoring process. And she now shoots, I mean, our, our styles are, are very similar. And so it's, it makes it really easy to have her in the boot or as, as a photographer, because the, the experience for the customer is that's a great day in photos, photo, not that's Amy's and that's so-and-so's and that's, oh, that's another person. It's all very cohesive. And that's, that's really important to me. Um, that the, the experience is one of, I can go in any ring and get, a good photo, not, oh shoot, I'm not in that ring today. So I'm not sure what I'm going to get. Right. Right. Yeah. So I'd imagine that there are a, well, probably more than a handful of unique challenges that come with photographing dogs, especially sports dogs, uh, compared to like people or other common photography subjects. Do you mind just talking about what some of those challenges are and how you guys deal with them? Sure. The, the most unique challenges really do come with the dog sports, um, especially, uh, it, it all comes down to speed. Um, you know, you can have, uh, an Olympic sprinter, um, you know, in a, in an Olympic stadium doing, doing their race. And I can track that with a camera really easily. Um, the camera cameras have been tuned to, to recognize the human form, um, in their, you know, in whatever algorithms are built into their little tiny brains these days, they, they have, well, and, and it's, I mean, you think about it all, so many cameras have facial recognition. Well, how does it know what a face is? Well, and, and what is, what is a face? Well, it's not looking for dog faces. It's looking for human faces. So there's something about the human form that a camera has been tuned to identify and, and, um, prioritize in its, you know, ability to focus. So I'm constantly fighting against some of those things that are built into the end, you know, that are engineered into the cameras.

Um, so fast black dogs in bad light, um, are, are like my nemesis. They are. So, and the smaller they are and the fuzzier they are, the worse it gets. So, um, I've, but I've taken that on as a challenge. Okay. So that is my hardest subject. Fast, tiny, fuzzy black dogs in bad light. So what I do is make sure that my skills and my gear is all, um, prioritizing being able to take a picture of that, that worst case dog. And it's nothing, nothing against black dogs, believe me, but, um, they are just, they are just the hardest thing to photograph. And so, um, and there's no, there's nothing like that in the, in the human sports, um, or even, you know, cars or, or, you know, whatever, there's nothing like it out there. Um, and so that's the, the most unique challenge I think. And so every time a new camera comes out, I'm always hoping for some feature that makes my job of photographing a small, fuzzy black dog in bad light a little bit easier. Um, but even, even just the non, you know, the, the normal, a typical dog, um, you know, they, they do move very fast. They move very, um, can move very, um, in very unexpected directions. They, they have, um, really good reflexes. And so tracking that motion can be very difficult. Um, they don't speak English. So if you want to tell them, you know, Hey, pose for me, you gotta, you gotta figure out what that word is, you know, is it treat or is it go for a ride or is it, are you ready? Um, you know, figure out what, what their trigger word is to make their ears go up and their mouth close and their eyes go kind of get a little brighter and go, Oh, Ooh, Ooh, something's going to happen. And then that's the moment you click as opposed to a human where you just say, okay, look at the camera. Everybody say cheese. Right. And everybody follows direction. Now, if you get a, a, a teenager who's really not into this, he might still get some, that's a great, uh, that's a great result, but, um, at least you can speak to them in a common language. Um, well, and the other challenge I'm finding, uh, that is actually, um, fascinating to me is as people work on their relationship with their dog, um, which is a fabulous thing. And I, that's one of my favorite things about going to a dog show and seeing those relationships. But as they do that, it makes it really hard for me. If I'm trying to do a picture of the human and the dog and the ribbon, the dog is gazing adoringly at the human and I can't get them to look at the camera. I don't care what word I throw out. There are times where it's just, I can't, you know, the dog won't look at me because they

are so engaged with their human and that's a lovely thing. And generally it's not been a problem that, you know, the, the person is generally okay with that, but still, if you want to get the dog, it's kind of a funny, um, you know, it's a good thing that the, the dog is so engaged with their, their person, but it makes my, my job just a little bit harder. So, um, it's, it's those weird things, but. So you mentioned kind of following gear and, um, and new things coming out and things like that. So I was curious what equipment you use and, you know, you, you kind of got a little bit into the why there, but if there's more you want to elaborate on. Sure. No. And oh man, I could talk gear for hours. I love gear. I love camera gear and it's a really good thing. I have a job that lets me write it off because otherwise, uh, that would be a problem. So, um, well, I, I, um, I shoot Canon primarily. Um, and I have Canon's top of the line, um, sports camera. It's called the 1DX Mark II. It is their latest and greatest, and it shoots 14 frames a second. It, um, can, it has a really high ISO rating, uh, or can shoot it at a really high ISO, which is the piece, the piece that's critical to shooting in the really bad lighting. Um, and, and actually my definition of bad lighting is somewhat different than, you know, the average Joe show on the street. Uh, you know, I need a camera needs a decent amount of light to shoot in. And, um, you know, our eyes are amazing. Our eyes can really accommodate a huge range of lighting conditions and cameras aren't quite to that point yet. So I need the high ISO so that I can have a high shutter speed so I can stop the motion of my small fuzzy black dog in bad light. Um, the camera body is, is the best I can, I, that money can buy. Um, at least in, in, in terms of an SLR, um, I use what's called fast glass. And that means that it's a lens with a really big opening for the light. It's a big aperture. Um, and so my favorite lens for shooting agility is a 400 millimeter F 2.8. And as my husband says, it just means it has a really big light bucket. Um, so it can collect a lot of light and make sure I'm getting enough light to, uh, again, get that fast shutter speed so that I can stop motion. I also have a Nikon camera and I, um, bought that about six months ago. Um, primarily because I felt like I needed to learn, um, Nikon camera bodies from, for my students. Um, I am able to give really specific advice, um, and troubleshooting information about Canon. And I was not able to give that same level of troubleshooting advice for, for Nikons.

Um, so I, I got a Nikon D 500, um, which is not quite their top of the line, but it's a really good performance camera for, uh, wildlife. Um, and I got a big lens for it. Um, and I use that for a lot of my bird photography these days. So, um, you know, learning, learning the, the, the other brand, the other major brand of, of camera has been a really good experience for me. Um, it's given me a new appreciation for, oh yeah, this is what it's like to, to open up a camera that you've never ever had your hands on before and be a little overwhelmed by all those buttons and dials and menu items and all that. So, um, uh, but yeah, so yeah, no, my, my equipment, I, I tend to get the best I can, um, which is easier for me to justify again, because it's a business as opposed to just a hobbyist who, you know, you've got to be a little more careful, um, about where, how you spend that money. But I do love gear. Um, you know, there's also, of course, all the accessories, there's monopods and tripods and, um, you know, there's, there's more lenses in, in, than just that 400 millimeter. And, um, that could be a whole, a whole podcast in and of itself probably. It's really kind of awesome that you are able to provide that kind of support, uh, in a class or to a student when you're talking about an icon versus a Canon. I would love to dive a little more into what you cover in your classes at FDSA. What are some of the skills you teach? Uh, I know right now, I think there are two classes or there are more than that on the calendar. Um, right now what's coming up in August, uh, are two classes. One of them is my foundation class called shoot the dog. Um, and in that class, we really just start from assuming people are starting from ground zero. Um, we learn the basics of exposure. Uh, we, we talk about shutter speed. We talk about aperture. We talk about ISO. We talk about the effects that each of those has on the way a photo looks, um, as well as just the technical details of, you know, what does it mean to have a fast shutter speed or what does it mean to have, um, a wide open aperture versus a closed down aperture? And then what is, you know, what does it mean? What does ISO mean? We don't delve too deeply into the, the Uber techie stuff, but, um, we do talk about that a bit, but really it comes down to what is, what effect if I change the shutter speed, how does that change how my photo looks? If I change the aperture, how does that change how my photo looks? When, when do I care? When should I care most about aperture and when should I care the most about shutter speed?

And we really work on trying to create photos that, that communicate to a broader audience than just you, you yourself. So one of my students used the phrase that she had read somewhere and I, I don't know where, but the difference between an emotional portrait and a photograph. And I, you know, we kind of laughed about it at first, but the more I think about it, I really, I think that's an important distinction. If I take a quick snapshot of my dog and it's not really in focus and the light's really not that great, but there's something in that expression that just screams, oh, that's, that's my dog. That's like the essence of my dog. It doesn't matter about the technical bits, bits. They, it doesn't matter if it's not quite as sharp as I would want it to be. It's an emotional portrait. I have an emotional connection to that. Now, if I post that online, my friends are probably going to say, oh, that's great. I love, you know, that, yes, that looks like Costner. That is so Costner. That's wonderful. But if I post it to a photography site in general, they're going to think I'm crazy because they can't see that emotion. They don't know my dog. They don't understand that that is, you know, like his quintessential expression. They think I can't really see what's going on in his face because the photo is a little dark and I can't see his eyes all that well because it's really not that in focus. And so we need, what I, what I really want students to do is to be able to conquer those technical bits, the sharpness and the exposure so that they can make that, the soul of the photo, make that really come through and be obvious to anybody rather than having all the technical stuff get in the way and mask the true soul of that photo, the true meaning of that photo. So that's a hard thing for people to do because it takes stepping back and really applying a critical eye to your photos and saying, oh yeah, I see how I can see the dog's expression, but I understand. I can see how someone else wouldn't be able to see it and read it as clearly as I can because they don't have the emotional connection to the dog, to the subject that I do. So that's something that, that really has started to be a common thread in all of my classes. Um, I, I, we want to move beyond the emotional portraits and believe me, they have their place. I, you know, I don't have any beef with them, but in my classes, I want to move beyond that and into something that, that can speak to a broader audience and get that emotional, emotional connection across.

So in August, you're teaching your foundational class and what's the other class that you're offering? Um, the other class is called case the dog. And this is really, you know, this is my kind of my wheelhouse and that is dogs in motion. Um, so we'll talk about, um, two different kinds. I kind of break it down into two different kinds of motion. There's, um, motion that's predictable and motion that's unpredictable. So the prime example of motion that's predictable is agility. And, you know, in general, there are always exceptions, but in general, the dog will go where it's supposed to go. There is a pre-established path. Um, you know, the obstacle, their number, you do this one and then you do that one. And so I know, and I can anticipate where the dog is going to be at any point, you know, in that run. So I can do things differently with that than if I am just photographing a dog that is, um, you know, having a good romp in the field, uh, you know, for play time with, with, so that would be the, the unpredictable motion. So, um, you know, you let your dog out and you want to take pictures of it just playing around. Well, unless you, you know, set up some sort of fencing system that makes the portions of the dog path, you know, you have no idea where that dog's going to go. So tracking that cameras, you know, there's, there's a limit to how fast they can track that motion. And then there's a limit of how fast I physically can track that motion. And this is where, you know, our fast dogs, um, you know, this is, this is tough. This is, there's a lot of skills and a lot of, a lot of practice that just has to happen of, um, you know, getting that muscle memory, you know, in, in you. And, um, you know, once you can track your own dog really well, that doesn't necessarily mean you can track another dog because all the dogs have a different rhythm. They all have their own unique characteristics about how they move. Um, so it, the, the, the class is really about, um, offering some skills for, um, you know, how to, how to do both predictable and unpredictable, unpredictable motion. But it's also about setting some realistic expectations of what can I expect to get out of, you know, a 10 minute photo session with a dog just running and playing in the field. Well, you're not going to end up with every photo being perfectly in sharp or perfectly in focus and, you know, a true winner. You're going to get a lot of, a lot of junk and that's okay. And that process of, of, of being okay with the junk is really hard. And takes, you know, it takes someone like me saying, it's okay. I have those too.

And, you know, what, what students in the class are going to see are a lot of mine, you know, rather than just the, the edited versions of, you know, here are the ones that I kept, they're going to see, well, here was a whole series that I shot and notice how many of those were actually good photos. And notice how many of those were not so great. Here's my junk. They're going to get to see my junk, my junk photos. Okay. Well, I better be a little careful here. They're going to get to see my junk photos. And I think that's a really important process to, to understand that you can't, there's no camera in the world good enough to capture everything. So let's talk about what's realistic. Let's talk about what you can expect. Let's talk about ways to increase the percentage of those keepers. But let's also, you know, become comfortable with the idea that you're going to have some, some clunkers in there. Now, I wanted to ask if there's one piece of advice that you can give listeners, something they can start working on today or tomorrow to help them take better photos of their dogs. What would that, what would that be? The first piece of advice I give everyone who asks me that question is to get down to the dog's level. And it's really easy and it's really basic and it does not matter what kind of camera you have. But if you change your perspective, instead of shooting your, the photo from your standing hike and looking down on the dog, get down to their level. You know, if that means, if you've got a little tiny dog, it may mean that you are on your belly in the grass taking a picture of that dog. But you will be amazed at how much of a difference that makes in the photo of your dog. If you don't want to get down to their level, then bring them up to your level. So if you have a grooming table, throw a nice tablecloth over it and put the dog up on the grooming table. Bring the dog up to your level. Just be on the same level as the dog that you're trying to take a picture of. And it, it, it transforms the whole thing. So that's my, that's my go-to piece of advice for anybody. That's great. Cause that's something that people can really just go do. Yeah, exactly. I know that we're talking about kind of a little bit different subject than we usually do here on the podcast, but I still wanted to ask you those kind of, those key questions that I always ask at the end, uh, with a slight tweak, cause I'm going to let you go into photography related stuff if you so choose. So, uh, to start, uh, what's the dog related or photography related accomplishment that you are proudest of?

There's the experience of going and shooting a national and that that's huge. That's great. And, and there's a feeling of kind of, I've arrived, you know, with that. Um, but the most recent thing that I'm proudest of is actually my experience at camp. Um, I had five of my students that came and were my, my minions as I called them. And they were the ones who actually did all of the photography for, um, the events at camp and being able to stand back and watch them in action was, I was really proud of them. And I was, that was a more of a feeling of accomplishment, um, than, than going to a national. I mean, I, I don't get me wrong. I love going to nationals. I love interacting with people. I love watching a great run and then being able to find them later and say, I saw that run and that was phenomenal. And it was beautiful. And I was so happy. I was able to capture that for you. Um, but working with students and then watching them, um, take the skills they've learned in my classes and, and do that for others, you know, capture those moments was really, that was cool. That was, um, really hard to beat. And now to extend on that, I am also, one of my sons has shown an interest in photography and he, um, was able to shoot the jumpers courses at the AKC trial that I shot last weekend. And, um, so again, I was able to, when I had a break, I, you know, went over to his ring and just stood back and watched and that seeing the next generation, whether it's, you know, the literal next generation or just a new group of photographers that have come through my courses, that being able to pass that information on has been really, really important. An amazing experience. That's really cool. Cause it's something that you managed to learn from your father and now you're passing it on. Exactly. Yeah. Yep. What is the best piece of advice? And this can be either for dog training or photography that you've ever heard and a bonus points if it applies to both, but it doesn't have to. The best thing that I've learned to do over the years, and I don't know that it's ever been told to me explicitly, but it's the thing that I have learned to do. Is to slow down and to think and to just breathe. And so that is the thing that I try and tell my students all the time, because there's this urge to the action in front of me is happening really fast. And so that means I have to grab my camera fast and throw it up to my face and press the shutter and, and get the picture really fast. And it doesn't work that way, or it doesn't work well that way.

So, you know, taking a moment to, you know, make sure your camera is set correctly for, for the situation you're trying to photograph, making sure that, um, you understand what's going on in front of you and, and can maybe anticipate what's going to happen next. And then just breathing. Cause you get, you know, if you, if you don't, if you get out of breath and, and, or find yourself holding your breath because you're just so excited, you, you end up messing it up more often than not. So, um, and that advice I think applies to dog training as well. Slow down, think, just breathe. And that kind of brings you back to center and lets you focus on what's important and focus on what the task at hand is. Block out everything else is going, everything else that's going on around you and just, you know, take it one thing at a time and, and the results will be much better. Bonus points earned. So a last question. Who is someone else in the dog world, uh, that you look up to? There are two people that come to mind immediately and it's not because of their dog training skills. It's because of their, the way they handle pressure in running their dog businesses. Um, and so the first one is Denise. I it's, um, you know, who, who isn't amazed by Denise and the way she handles FTSA really. And that's, and that's, and I'm not trying to get brownie points for her, but I just, I mean, as, as a business owner myself, it's really important to find those people, um, who are running their own business and who I admire how they handle that business. Um, you know, Denise has the pressure of thousands of students. Um, she has the pressure of all of the instructors who, um, meeting some of them at camp was an eyeopening experience and I love them all, but I admire Denise even more for her ability to handle all of us. Um, and our quirks. So, um, but to, to watch her handle that pressure, um, of both the negative and the positive is, is really has become important to me. Um, I know one of her things is people won't remember what you say, but they'll remember how you make them feel. And that is a phrase that runs through my mind constantly as I am dealing with customers or if I'm dealing with students. Um, and even with my family, um, it's changed the way I interact with, with everybody and including my family. And to say in my mind, you know, yes, I really want to make that snarky comment, but that's probably not the best way to handle it.

So, um, because it's, it's going to make me feel better, but it's not going to do anything for our relationship and it's not going to do anything for them and the way they feel. So that's been a really good thing for me. The other person, um, that I look up to for similar reasons is Carrie DeYoung, who is the head of AKC Agility. And I work with her a lot because I do both of AKC's big agility events for the year. Um, so I watch her and how she interacts with her staff and then watch how she interacts with the exhibitors at those national events and her calmness and her, I have never seen her flustered. Um, I, you know, I, I'm sure inside there are probably moments of, you know, facepalm or screaming or whatever, cause we all have those, but she does a really good job of on the outside. She holds it all together. And that's something that I don't always feel like I do very well, but watching her has, has helped me do that better. Um, so she's another person I really admire in the way that she, granted, she doesn't, she doesn't own AKC, but she is, you know, she's the queen bee of, of the agility piece. And, uh, I just, I really admire the way she handles all of the, I mean, if you think about any agility organization, there are things that people want to tell them to do differently, things they like, things they don't like. Um, and to be able to handle all of that constantly takes some real talent and skill. So, I mean, and I, I admire anybody who trains dogs because I, I don't have that talent and I don't have the patience to develop it. I know that I could, but it kind of goes back to the whole, I live with dogs that are dumber than me. And so, I mean, I really, I love watching good trainers. I loved coming to camp and watching all these amazing instructors that I get to call my, you know, my colleagues. Um, I loved watching them work with people and with dogs. And, uh, it just, that, that kind of level of, of discipline fascinates me. So, um, you know, I, there's lots to admire about the, the training side and the dog world in that respect. But for me, what's been most important is to find those people and specifically, you know, women, um, that are at the top of, of their game and dealing with those pressures that come with being at the top of their game. Awesome. Well, thank you so much for coming on the podcast, Amy. You're welcome. It was a pleasure. It was, it was a lot of fun to chat. And, uh, thanks to all of our listeners for tuning in. We'll be back next week with Kamal Fernandez to discuss what it's like to be a man in a female dominated job. Uh, just kidding.

We'll be chatting, uh, FCI style healing and more. Uh, if you haven't already subscribed to the podcast and iTunes or the podcast app of your choice to have our next episode automatically downloaded to your phone as soon as it becomes available. Today's show is brought to you by the Fenzie Dog Sports Academy. Special thanks to Denise Fenzie for supporting this podcast. Music provided royalty free by bensound.com. The track featured here is called Buddy. Audio editing provided by Chris Lang. Transcription written by CLK Transcription Services. Thanks again for tuning in and happy training.